Spoilers ST Lower Decks - Starships and Technology Season One Discusssion

[Timo]

I guess it depends on the font.

If it's California class, it's named after USS California all right, and the ambiguity is there.

If it's California class, it's a class where ships are named on a theme of California, just like the RN has its Town and County classes that never include a HMS Town or a HMS County. Thus, while there might be a USS California, she wouldn't be the class ship, just one of the humble ships named after humble places in California, one of which is California.

That is, unless it follows the currently more common US practice of always giving the class up straight rather than in italics.



Timo Saloniemi

 

[137th Gebirg]

Further speculation before I settle in to properly watch the episode:

The USS Merced, following the nomenclature logic in this show, is named for the City of Merced in California, presumably along the same lines as the City of Cerritos, CA getting a namesake for our shows. Both are California-class. But does this mean there that the actual USS California is named for the state, or the eponymous city some 100 miles north of Los Angeles?

And what does this mean in turn for the USS Illinois, aboard which Freeman and Durango both served together in (counts fingers) 2365? Are we implying she's the class ship, or a ship named for the actual City of Illinois that resides in the same state? And again, would the USS Vancouver be part of a British Columbia-class, or perhaps a Washington-class despite living in the shadow of the much better-known centre of Canadian arts, enterprise, and cannabis culture?

The closest analogy we have here are the DS9 runabouts, which are all named for Earth rivers, but the class vessel is named after a river herself. Thoughts?

Mark

PS - 2365, eh? Now looking forward to fanart of Freeman and/or Durango sporting TNG Season 1-2 uniforms.

Well, if we follow the canonical Excelsior and Defiant classes, the actual physical ships after which said classes were named, along with a myriad of ships-never-seen, it would stand to reason that the Class Ship was named the USS California. Is there a California city?

We do have a couple of exceptions - the "NX" class, as far as I know, has no USS NX. That would be weird. Additionally, the TOS Enterprise was referred to on its dedication plaque as the rather ambiguously named "Starship Class", not Constitution, as was retconned in on-screen later on in TNG. And don't get me started on the whole "Constitution" vs "Enterprise" class for the refit. I don't want to get into that never-ending debate again!

And, for the record, it's "Enterprise Class" for the refit, BTW!

 

[Timo]

...But Constitution class for the re-refit.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Mark_Nguyen]

Depends on which class we're talking here. The class of '85, perhaps.

Oh look! Is that a rabbit hole I see?

Mark

 

[UssGlenn]

If it's California class, it's a class where ships are named on a theme of California, just like the RN has its Town and County classes that never include a HMS Town or a HMS County.

the TOS Enterprise was referred to on its dedication plaque as the rather ambiguously named "Starship Class", not Constitution, as was retconned in on-screen later on in TNG.

If we assume Starfleet names classes for either naming theme or the first ship, depending on how the Admiral is feeling that day, the "Starship Class" ships are named after famous Starships. We know the Enterprise shares her name with one.

If Starfleet changes it's mind then it's simple just to rename the class after the first ship, the Constitution.

And there's no reason the prototype California class can't be the USS California, with the rest being cities, just because they didn't do it that way on the Danube class. maybe Starfleet just thought USS Earth Rivers sounded stupid.

 

[Ronald Held]

Could there be periods of time where Starfleet builds few large ships versus a variety of sizes?

 

[Dukhat]

There is a USS Excelsior NCC-21445 that was shown on an Okudagram in TNG, so there's precedence that Starfleet can name a newer ship the same name as an older class ship, so the U.S.S. Merced being a California class ship despite an older Merced class being in existence is not a problem. As for the high registry of the Merced? I can chalk that up to Starfleet giving a million runabouts their own registry numbers, artificially inflating the numbers to 87XXX by 2380. Of course, by PIC's time of 2500, ship registries would probably be NCC-529743 or something. I'm hoping that a new registry scheme has been developed for circa-2500's Starfleet vessels.

 

[Guy Gardener]

So they poop in the holodeck.

Holographic 20th century plumbing is more preferable to squeezing your but into the replicator pad and recycling your waste in front of your family.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Why poop when they have bathrooms (supposedly). No, I think it was...something else... more uniquely suited to holodeck use.

 

[Tuskin38]

Or a deflector dish.

I think this is the Vancouver (or at least a ship of the same class) from the 'This season on trailer', and there is what seems to be a deflector under there.

 

[NCC-73515]

Did we ever see anything brought into the holodeck from outside that remained there when the program was ended?

 

[matthunter]

Did we ever see anything brought into the holodeck from outside that remained there when the program was ended?

Yes, the users...

 

[137th Gebirg]

And their clothes.

 

[Mike McDevitt]

Did we ever see anything brought into the holodeck from outside that remained there when the program was ended?

I did not fact check this lately, but I recall a (Dead) Son'a soldier is seen vanishing in the holoship when the holoprogram ends in "Insurrection". While this may have been a continuity error, (or even the Mandela effect until I check on it) I have conjectured that any non-living organic material you leave in a holodeck will be recycled (or as it now seems, stored in stinky jars in the walls). From poops to whole corpses. Yea? Nay?

 

[Tim Thomason]

I imagine that if some people spend a fair amount of time in a holodeck (maybe book one for an entire vacation/shore leave?), then they would leave all sorts of excretions. Sweat, skin cells, feces, the relatively minor stuff Ransom was talking about, whatever. If you bring a book or an apple, I would think that the holodeck wouldn't destroy your book or apple, it would just fall to the ground (or be gently placed) when you end program. Unless you eat most of the apple or tear out most of the book. At that point, the AI kicks in and tries to figure out your intention with the foreign object.

Given the amount of waste material, I assume that the holodeck collects it over a lengthy period of time (porous material and robotic cleaning to remove it from its walls, floors, and ceilings, with air scrubbers as well), and funnels it into these collection material. Why an Ensign has to bring it out rather than allowing it to shoot or transport to a proper disposal place (probably for recycling into the replicators) is unknown to me. Maybe it's just busy work for the ensigns, or perhaps they've had issues with overcomplicating the system.

 

[Tim Thomason]

Well, if we follow the canonical Excelsior and Defiant classes, the actual physical ships after which said classes were named, along with a myriad of ships-never-seen, it would stand to reason that the Class Ship was named the USS California. Is there a California city?

There is a California City (usually nicknamed Cal City) of about 14,000 people, in the Mojave desert (home of Christopher Pike). I would assume a ship would be called USS California City rather than USS California, but who knows. There's also 10 municipalities in other U.S. states named California.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Maybe it's just busy work for the ensigns, or perhaps they've had issues with overcomplicating the system.

There's a reason that the M1 Abrams tank has a human loader for the shells while most other modern tanks use fancy "Auto Loaders". Not everything is worth creating a contraption to solve your problems.

Sometimes good ole humanoid muscle power can solve the job easily and more reliably then some contraption you built to do the job, and have to maintain / inspect / update / test the mechanisms of over time.

 

[dupersuper]

I did not fact check this lately, but I recall a (Dead) Son'a soldier is seen vanishing in the holoship when the holoprogram ends in "Insurrection". While this may have been a continuity error, (or even the Mandela effect until I check on it) I have conjectured that any non-living organic material you leave in a holodeck will be recycled (or as it now seems, stored in stinky jars in the walls). From poops to whole corpses. Yea? Nay?

So it's a perfect "get away with murder" room? That sounds poorly thought out...

 

[Timo]

Quark's holosuite served as a murder mystery venue right off the bat, in "A Man Alone", and a big element there was that one could find DNA traces there. Granted, that particular holoprogram apparently hadn't concluded, shut down, washed and rinsed yet, but still.

Then again, one can find traces of corpses that have been phasered to oblivion and/or roasted in a plasma conduit. Make-disappear is apparently but an approximation in Star Trek, and it takes cartoon resolution to help us finally resolve this...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Ronald Held]

From what we have seen, can we estimate the crew complement?