TOS Enterprise Internals

[blssdwlf]

Actually that screencap from "The Corbomite Maneuver" is when the phaser beams stop firing. The beam that appears to be higher is just the first one to stop. The beam actually comes out of the lower ring like the other beam. Here is a screencap where the beams initially come out.

This screencap shows what I was talking about, with at least one beam up bit higher:

And this image shows the painted yellow or black hatches and the underside of the saucer to which I was referring, which could be the step before ball turrets:

"Arena" has the phasers coming out of a different area on the saucer.

For other episodes where phaser beams are fired they come from the ring above the lower dome as seen in "The Corbomite Maneuver".

Forward phasers...

Forward + port?

These appear to be port-side phasers from "The Doomsday Machine" as the beams appear to come from behind the sensor dome.

and "The Alternative Factor" a single forward beam.

The proximity-blast pulse phasers seen in "Errand of Mercy" and "Balance of Terror" appear to emanate from 3 different points surrounding the lower dome.

"Arena" does give a good reason to think that phaser emitters can be anywhere hidden under the surface of the ship and not just limited to lower dome ring area and it doesn't have to correspond to any visible panels or hatches.

 

[publiusr]

The very skin of aircraft may become emitters, according to what I read once—-something else embedded in the TOS Thermocoat?

Surface emitting beams described:
https://opg.optica.org/oe/fulltext.cfm?uri=oe-30-2-3066&id=468503
https://www.findlight.net/blog/surface-emitting-lasers/

https://www.edn.com/air-force-revea...oaking-system-uses-dark-emitting-diodes-deds/

This might mean the phaser banks can just pump power to the skin….and emerge anywhere.

I think the “hottest” phasers come from the dome itself…

 

[yotsuya]

I'm glad all of you have looked into this. That is a lot of information to absorb. What components of the phaser do you think Scotty was looking at in his computer display? Jefferies recycled some sort of technical diagram of a spherical tank, but labeled it as part of the phaser system. I have been looking it as the emitter, but given some of the ideas, it could be almost anything.

 

[publiusr]

By TMP, each of those was its own unit with conduits to the secondary hull warp core.
In TOS, I think they are internal, and several ring the fire control room at the center of the saucer and tie into impulse/alt generator only I envision them slanted downward, inward—towards the sensor dome, the energies redirected. The dome helped amplify things.

The phaser coolant leaks that killed Tomlinson in Balance’ caused the banks to eventually be mounted in TMP style turrets to reduce…but not quite eliminate…coolant leaks.

But the thermocoat, in perhaps also acting like an emitter, spread out incoming fire…giving an in-universe reason why the TOS ship didn’t scar the way the Refit did with exposed plates in Wrath of Khan.

Ent-D had phaser strips and duck-egg blue thermocoats…but Klingons stepped things up to scar even that.

That’s my head canon anyway.

It helps explain why the TOS seemed in some ways more powerful than the Refit.

 

[blssdwlf]

Scotty in "The Trouble With Tribbles" was looking at some kind of technical journal. However it is very limited information. On a SD TV you couldn't read the labels or title. On HD TV you might be able to work out the word "Phasers" and "Class" but not know which one since the monitor hood obscures the left corner. There isn't anything directly on-screen to show what a ship's phaser emitter looks like except for maybe the ones depicted in "The Cage" (which likely was a laser, iirc).

edit: But, if you were to use the bts diagram at face-value then it cannot be an emitter but just a part of what makes the phaser work. The legend has nothing for phaser emitter or power and is mostly about pressure and monitoring. So maybe a coolant pump or reservoir, IMHO.

I'm glad all of you have looked into this. That is a lot of information to absorb. What components of the phaser do you think Scotty was looking at in his computer display? Jefferies recycled some sort of technical diagram of a spherical tank, but labeled it as part of the phaser system. I have been looking it as the emitter, but given some of the ideas, it could be almost anything.

 

[137th Gebirg]

I always wondered about the etymology of this diagram. Was it custom-made for the show by the set dressing department, or is it just a schematic of some random mechanical gadget someone found and slapped the "Primary Phaser" callouts on it? Genuinely curious...

 

[ChallengerHK]

I always wondered about the etymology of this diagram. Was it custom-made for the show by the set dressing department, or is it just a schematic of some random mechanical gadget someone found and slapped the "Primary Phaser" callouts on it? Genuinely curious...

It's in the Sketchbook, and I think it has an attribution. Mine's packed away in storage or I'd check.

 

[yotsuya]

I always wondered about the etymology of this diagram. Was it custom-made for the show by the set dressing department, or is it just a schematic of some random mechanical gadget someone found and slapped the "Primary Phaser" callouts on it? Genuinely curious...

From what I have been able to find, it is an aircraft air pressure tank diagram. Matt Jefferies was in charge of finding it and making the graphic (Today we call them Okudagrams because Michael Okuda made so many of them for TNG and beyond). There is another one in Space Seed that has been identified as a detail of a wing.

 

[Henoch]

But, if you were to use the bts diagram at face-value then it cannot be an emitter but just a part of what makes the phaser work. The legend has nothing for phaser emitter or power and is mostly about pressure and monitoring. So maybe a coolant pump or reservoir, IMHO.

I see it as a ship's (i.e. primary) phaser energy generator/accumulator, one of many in a collection which makes up a phaser bank...maybe?

 

[Mres_was_framed!]

I'm glad all of you have looked into this. That is a lot of information to absorb. What components of the phaser do you think Scotty was looking at in his computer display? Jefferies recycled some sort of technical diagram of a spherical tank, but labeled it as part of the phaser system. I have been looking it as the emitter, but given some of the ideas, it could be almost anything.

To me, it looks like it could be one "ball" of a "ball turret," with the circular "seal"-looking part, labeled 3 in the upper diagram, being the part that opens to let out the beam. That means I could see it two ways:

1. It is a new upcoming design for the next iteration of ship and that is why it is in Scotty's journal. (From the technical journals he is talking about reading while on leave.)

2. It is a current or older ship design and Scotty is looking at it to compare to a newer design that was on the next or previous page of the journal mentioned above. (This could be supported but the use of the Mark IX designation, as opposed to a number like that would match registries like 1017, 1701 and so on.)

So to my mind it is choice 2; and the ball turret design existed before TOS and is somehow still found in a part of the TOS systems, perhaps behind hatches, or physically a part of the ring somehow. This design will get updated and changed for more power over a long time until eventually replaced with strips, apparently without moving parts, for the Ambassador class.

The phaser arrays in TNG are called Type-X arrays, and they are the phaser strips also present on the Ambassador class. So then the design in the diagram is type IX, the previous design to TNG, and it looks like a ball turret.

The proximity-blast pulse phasers seen in "Errand of Mercy" and "Balance of Terror" appear to emanate from 3 different points surrounding the lower dome.

Can you provide screenshots for this? I was curious check that out before my last post but I could not find any good screenshots for that at TrekCore.

But the thermocoat,

There is a lot to like about "Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise" but I've never liked that as an explanation for the "Aztec pattern" on the TMP hull. In fact, I do not like the idea of there being an explanation for the difference. The TOS hull was just a bit smoother, and in TMP the panels are more obviously visible; also we we see the ship much closer. That is all the explanation needed.

 

[ChallengerHK]

I see it as a ship's (i.e. primary) phaser energy generator/accumulator, one of many in a collection which makes up a phaser bank...maybe?

I had thought that for a hot minute. Thing is, the callouts talk about air routing; I'm presuming that these would be for cooling, but for the energies we're looking at for these systems, I don't think air would be sufficient.

 

[yotsuya]

There is a lot to like about "Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise" but I've never liked that as an explanation for the "Aztec pattern" on the TMP hull. In fact, I do not like the idea of there being an explanation for the difference. The TOS hull was just a bit smoother, and in TMP the panels are more obviously visible; also we we see the ship much closer. That is all the explanation needed.

Yes, Mr. Scott's is problematic. Good for an introductory book, but not good when you start studying the source material yourself.

My take is that for the NX class the hull plating couldn't be painted. They they changed something and had some sort of coating or paint. So the 1701 shows weathering. The 1701 refit is back to bare hull plating which dulls over time (explaining the dullcoat applied for TWOK - something that fits the change from TVH to TUC as well). Later ships had mixed hull types with some paint and some bare panels. I see it all as just keeping the hull up to date with the latest materials. As time goes on the deflectors and shields get better and the hull gets less and less direct wear so holds up better. In reality it is just different attempts at adding depth to the models (or lack of adding depth).

 

[yotsuya]

I had thought that for a hot minute. Thing is, the callouts talk about air routing; I'm presuming that these would be for cooling, but for the energies we're looking at for these systems, I don't think air would be sufficient.

As I study that diagram I have come to the conclusion that it shows two version of the same thing. The fittings are nearly identical and the round tank has an extension so it could bolt into the same place as the larger tank. So I think in relation to phasers this diagram shows an upgrade. Maybe a potential upgrade.

 

[ChallengerHK]

The phaser arrays in TNG are called Type-X arrays, and they are the phaser strips also present on the Ambassador class. So then the design in the diagram is type IX, the previous design to TNG, and it looks like a ball turret.

I track your thinking and I agree with much of it. This part doesn't ring true to me. I find it tough to believe that there's only a single iterative advance in phaser tech in 78 years.

 

[Mres_was_framed!]

I track your thinking and I agree with much of it. This part doesn't ring true to me. I find it tough to believe that there's only a single iterative advance in phaser tech in 78 years.

I'm glad that you agree with most of this. Let me clarify, I am suggesting that the iteration big enough to change a Roman Numeral is a BIG change, with many smaller iterations taking place that do not change the Roman Numeral. I am thinking in terms of larger version numbers coming out only at major changes, while smaller version numbers can still change.

I just checked, and the FOSS software for editing pictures, called GIMP, can do most of what Photoshop can and is only on version 2 after something like 20+ years. But they call the current version something like 2.20.32, using dots and numbers for smaller iterations, and yet still update it several times a year. I suggested that "Mark IX," is the ball turret system generally, and that there could be MANY small iterations through the Excelsior class and its variants, until the Ambassador got a "Mark X" that was the start of the strip system.

 

[ChallengerHK]

I just checked, and the FOSS software for editing pictures, called GIMP, can do most of what Photoshop can and is only on version 2 after something like 20+ years.

At least in my world GIMP and QuadTone Rip are used primarily for optimizing images for print.

 

[Unicron]

The FASA Trek RPG has a range of different weapon systems, but higher models don't always mean overall superiority. The FH-10 phaser system had more hitting power than the prior FH-9 model but less range, and issues trying to mesh with the M-4 computers for fire control. The FH-11 attempted to correct some of these flaws but had some problems with the beam staying cohesive, with the FH-12 finally achieving a nice balance for a medium phaser. The FH-13, intended to be another refinement of the 11, actually wound up being less powerful and ranged than the previous model.

The FP series of photon torpedo systems had a number of downsides even though the various models offered good destructive power, chiefly issues with targeting accuracy and range due to trying to find a good computer system to mate with the launchers. The FP-2 launcher was intended for use on smaller vessels and had less range and power than the FP-1, with the FP-3 having weaker range while retaining the same power as the FP-2.

The FP-4 was the first version to make a significant step forward, in terms of both firepower and computer improvements. The FP-5 through FP-7 models followed a similar pattern of being modified for smaller vessels, with corresponding flaws in performance (the 7 has much better range than earlier models but only average hitting power).

 

[blssdwlf]

@Mres_was_framed!

Here you go... the 3 starting points for the proximity-blast phasers...

Front of lower dome

Starboard or Starboard Aft of lower dome

and Aft or Bottom of lower dome. Or maybe even Port Aft but with a huge amount of glare?

 

[yotsuya]

This applies to other things as well. Windows 8 famously came out configured for touch screen tablets so it was near unusable with a mouse on a desktop machines leaving Windows 7 to be the better OS until Windows 10 came out. Most government and businesses jumped from 7 to 10 and skipped 8 unless they had a touch screen device. So higher number does not always mean better. Though in general it does.

The FASA numbering is interesting and does fit with typical military systems. Numbers are not always sequential and some newer models were designed for a lower rated application. So I can see that the IX on the phaser screen might stand for ball turret system with various sub-designations to indicate the gradual upgrades to the technology.

In my timeline for the TOS era, you have 9 different Constitution Class variations (3 hulls, 3 different variations per hull and then ship to ship differences) with the first hull being Jefferies design, the second being Franz Joseph's, and third being Jefferies Phase II design (the hull remained the same when Taylor changed the details and nacelles for the refit). So the ball turret would appear about the time Scotty is looking at that diagram. So the image on the left is what Enterprise has at that moment and on the right is what the upgrade to the ball turret would be. FJ drew them larger than they were on the Movie era ships. So the Mark IX.1 Phaser is FJ's. The Mark IX.2 would be the TMP Refit (smaller, but essentially the same design).

To fill in my concept of the hull progression it would be:
TOS Pilot 1 - Original Enterprise launch configruation aka CC1 (CC is Constitution Class)
TOS Pilot 2 - aka CC1U1 (U is upgrade)
TOS Series - aka CC1U2
Franz Joseph General Plans - aka CC2
USS Constitution (my refit) - aka CC2U1
Mike Minor Phase II concept - CC2U2
Jefferies Phase II - CC3
Richard Taylor revisions - CC3U1
Andrew Probert Revisions - CC3U2
And if you want to include it as a different one, the 1701A is CC3U3 (though the only exterior difference is a slight change to the deflector grid and a different hanger configuration which is more a ship to ship variation than a hull variation). I've made a whole timeline and list of ships that has a lot more than 13 ships overall, but never more than what we hear about on screen at any given time. That is based on the 4 ships we see lost in about a year period between seasons 2 and 3 (with Defiant being a brand new ship and probably one of the last CC1U2 configuration.

 

[Henoch]

I have a big problem with the concept of ball-type, phasers under hatches. We know phasers are fired at ship warp/FTL speeds, which would mean that the turret balls and hatches would need to operate or physically move at very high (warp/FTL/light) speeds, too. The fastest mechanism observed during the three years of the series is probably the sliding doors on the turbolifts which are painfully slow compared to the speed of light (the Scalosians would agree). Same with TMP ball turrets if they are expected to rotate or move which I don't think they do in any of the VXF shots in the movies, so, the aiming is probably "electronic" and not physical movement. Elaan of Troyius showed us that it is easier to move/rotate the ship at warp speed to target other high-warp speed vessels than the aiming/firing system could do on its own. I assume this last observation is why the ship's weapons are controlled by the helmsman. YMMV.