Why Section 31?

[Albertese]

It seems like Section 31 is an idea that has proven pretty popular with a lot of fans and the current show-runners alike. What's the appeal?

Now, when it was originally introduced in DS9, I got it. It was a neat idea that there was this super secret clandestine organization that may have actually just been the one guy in the end. There was a sense of mystery to it and it seemed to hint at a possible shadowy layer to Starfleet's shiny persona... And that was certainly enough for my taste. Seems like they went ahead and just ran with that concept. Ran and ran and ran.

Personally, I think Section 31, while being an intriguing plotline for a thread of DS9, generally sours the flavor of Star Trek.

So, what do you think? If you are like me and don't care for Section 31 story material, feel free to yell into my echo chamber. If you think it's great, compelling stuff tell me why. Help me see why people find this appealing.

Discuss!

--Alex

 

[NCC-73515]

31 was interesting in DS9 and ENT, but then Disco made it a regular, well-known organization, and in LD, ensigns know about it as well. That's how you kill an interesting concept - by making it an everyday normal thing.

 

[somebuddyX]

There's something alluring to people about black ops groups working behind the scenes. I'm of a few minds about the whole thing. I never liked that Section 31 had been around for hundreds of years because every writer and their dog wants to tie every nefarious deed that every Starfleet officer ever did into them. I always liked that people like Admiral Pressman, or Admiral Leyton or Admiral Cartwright were either just independent assholes or fell down the rabbit hole on their own volition rather than palming responsibility onto someone else. That being said I can see the point that if this organisation existed and you are going to introduce some secret Starfleet spy agency into your storyline then why not introduce them into Enterprise or Discovery or Into Darkness, instead of fans saying why not just use Section 31. Now that being said, how much are you changing it from the original concept of this super secret agency so that it might as well be a just a completely different group like a legit Starfleet black ops group instead. Maybe Starfleet Intelligence or Starfleet Security don't sound cool enough but maybe it's Directive Six or Segment Alpha or some other dumb name.
I sort of wish that Section 31 had just formed as a consequence of the Dominion War, that it was formed from former Starfleet officers that Sisko or Bashir or whoever knew and maybe amongst them was characters from past TNG or DS9 episodes who'd gone off the rails because of the Changeling and Dominion threat. That way you could keep your 23rd century and 24th century groups as different entities and comment in different ways that threats from within will always be coming at you in different forms.
I do like that Bashir ended up as a member of S31 in Sid's Alone Together series though.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I think it's odd that modern Trek (starting with Into Darkness in 2013) had reintepreted the secret conspiracy Section 31 as a legitimate branch of Starfleet with their own ships, bases and soon their own spin-off series. But I enjoy both versions.

The entire concept completely undermines Starfeet and the Federation as the squaky clean "good guys" and personally I love that. Trek's optimistic future has always been implausible to me, and the idea that Kirk, Pike, Picard and the rest are the public face while these other guys are in the shadows making it all work through less-than-nice means appeals to me.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

I don't think Section 31 should've been public in any way shape or form.

What part of "Secret Agency" or "Clandestine Organization" do these people not understand?

With JJ Trek & DIS making them public to some degree, it ruins alot of the mystique and credibility.

When JJ Abrams did "Alias", they made SD-11 a true "Secret Organization" pretending to be the CIA.

That kind of hiding in plain sight is what we need Section 31 to be.

Section 31 would be a great "Entry Method" into the day to day life of average UFP citizens by day and Secret Agent by night.

But please for the love of all that is good, make them a proper "Clandestine" organization.

 

[1001001]

31 was interesting in DS9 and ENT, but then Disco made it a regular, well-known organization, and in LD, ensigns know about it as well. That's how you kill an interesting concept - by making it an everyday normal thing.

Everyone knows the CIA exists.

Very few people actually know the details of what they do.

 

[BillJ]

Personally, I think Section 31, while being an intriguing plotline for a thread of DS9, generally sours the flavor of Star Trek.

I agree. So much for humanity becoming better as we reach out to the stars.

 

[J.T.B.]

Was the origin related to a late-1990s vogue for conspiratorial stories due to the X-Files?

 

[Kor]

I thought it was interesting in DS9 and ENT, and even in ST:ID. A challenge to the unrealistic idealism that TNG had bonked on our heads.
But the STDisco writers didn't get it.

Kor

 

[fireproof78]

I personally think its fine, showcasing that the Federation has layers to it, and that not everyone is going to find safety and security in utopia.

 

[BillJ]

I personally think its fine, showcasing that the Federation has layers to it, and that not everyone is going to find safety and security in utopia.

There should be ways to show it without backsliding into territory tackled by every other spy show/movie out there. IMO

 

[fireproof78]

There should be ways to show it without backsliding into territory tackled by every other spy show/movie out there. IMO

For me that's part of the appeal. You have Trek's more optimistic future framing device (not utopian) with people generally working together. But, there are those who simply do not find safety in such a concept, either due to personality, or personal experience, or whatnot. So, they seek it outside of that framework.

And, the funny thing to me, is that this is replete throughout Star Trek. You have characters like Mudd, Vash, Okana, and the smugglers in "The Gambit." Also in a lot of novels. So, I think that exploring it within the context of a show is more interesting to me, because of the framing device.

Mileage etc.

 

[NCC-73515]

Everyone knows the CIA exists.

Very few people actually know the details of what they do.

SI = CIA
31 =|= CIA

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

31 =|= CIA

Section 31 = SD-6 from "Alias"

 

[Qonundrum]

Because they were envious of the ice cream place but wanted instead of ice cream flavors they wanted to promote 31 levels of Mirror Kira instead?

 

[1001001]

SI = CIA
31 =|= CIA

I don’t know what that’s supposed to mean, but my point is perfectly valid.

Many governments have “secret” branches that perform covert ops, clandestine missions in “enemy territory”, and so forth. They may even, on occasion, skirt the law for “national security” (black site prisons?). Whether it’s the CIA, DHS, MI6, or the SVR, the agencies are both “secret” and “known”.

Section 31 is no different. It’s a pretty simple concept.

 

[NCC-73515]

All these agencies are known, have official websites and wiki pages, and are discussed in the news and depicted in movies.

In DS9 and probably also in ENT, 31 is only known to some Admirals and those who 31 decides to reach out to, their existence is not acknowledged or denied. Or so it was until Disco changed it to a regular organization.

Pretty simple indeed.

 

[Lord Garth]

Was the origin related to a late-1990s vogue for conspiratorial stories due to the X-Files?

The most likely answer. It was also the exact same time I came of age. So that's both where it probably came from and why I don't have a problem with Section 31 like a lot other people here do.

 

[1001001]

All these agencies are known, have official websites and wiki pages, and are discussed in the news and depicted in movies.

In DS9 and probably also in ENT, 31 is only known to some Admirals and those who 31 decides to reach out to, their existence is not acknowledged or denied. Or so it was until Disco changed it to a regular organization.

Pretty simple indeed.

A distinction without a difference.

 

[fireproof78]

The most likely answer. It was also the exact same time I came of age. So that's both where it probably came from and why I don't have a problem with Section 31 like a lot other people here do.

Same reason why the Temporal Investigators showed up. A reference to the X-Files.

I don’t know what that’s supposed to mean, but my point is perfectly valid.

Many governments have “secret” branches that perform covert ops, clandestine missions in “enemy territory”, and so forth. They may even, on occasion, skirt the law for “national security” (black site prisons?). Whether it’s the CIA, DHS, MI6, or the SVR, the agencies are both “secret” and “known”.

Section 31 is no different. It’s a pretty simple concept.

Indeed, yes. Even S31's entire operation would not known to everyone, even if their existence was. Most intelligence agencies now have a job you can talk about and one you can't. S31 just takes the "can't talk about it" to the next extreme.