Spoilers Paris Rank Question

[Timo]

Indeed, the early season 1 episodes of Voyager, both Tom and B'Elanna wore the rank insignia of Full Lieutenant and Tuvok wore Lt Commander's, despite the fact he was supposed to be a Lieutenant as stated in dialogue and the opening credits. When they finally got around to correcting Tuvok's rank insignia, the decision was made to change Tom and B'Elanna to LT JG in order to show Tuvok had seniority over them.

And there was a perfect excuse there. Janeway loves to take pips from her underlings. Tuvok and Torres screwed up big time in "Prime Factors". Tom Paris doesn't really need an episode dedicated to the fact that he will screw up big time.

The exact mechanisms of the demotions (Tuvok's pips going back and forth madly during "Cathexis") we can dismiss. The basic idea is more or less sound.

...And explains Harry Kim. Because if Tuvok indeed was a LCDR during the first season, then Janeway never ever promoted anybody. She was probably waiting for the handwritten signatures of three flag officers as required by Starfleet rules and regulations.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oddish]

NEELIX: We're all out of corn.

Of course. Because if Janeway is the Chuck Norris of Trek, Harry is its answer to Wile E. Coyote.

And explains Harry Kim. Because if Tuvok indeed was a LCDR during the first season, then Janeway never ever promoted anybody. She was probably waiting for the handwritten signatures of three flag officers as required by Starfleet rules and regulations.

Except Voyager was in contact with Starfleet near the end. They could (and should) have directed Janeway to dole out promotions to several of her hapless one-pippers.

 

[Timo]

But not if the promotion really required the pen, the ink and the hand (and holographic equivalents wouldn't do). Janeway really was a stickler to rules, and promoted the stick (replicator rations even after the replicators were fixed, say) rather than the carrot throughout the trip. If every "promotion" was merely the reversal of a punitive demotion, I'd hardly raise an eyebrow.

Really, Janeway might consider it bad for morale if she "gave up" and allowed promotions that untl then had depended on the ship getting home!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oddish]

Would Starfleet actually promote someone that stupidly inflexible to captain?

*Oddish looks at Jellico*

All right, I get it. But would they promote that muffinhead to admiral?

*Oddish looks at several Starfleet admirals*

Ok, I get the point. Congratulations, you have actually produced a scenario, bizarre and irrational as it was, where Harry's long ensignhood could make sense... were it not for B'Elanna Torres.

The hardcore rank stickler Janeway you described... if she would not promote an academy graduate to lieutenant based on his competence, she would not promote an academy dropout to chief engineer, (over the head of Lt. Carey) based on her competence either.

 

[Timo]

Oh, Torres' rank always was make-believe only. The Maquis got pretty neck ornaments loosely based on their standing in Chakotay's original chain of command - and, separately, Janeway chose a circle of top officers whose rank was of no interest to her (Harry Kim, say).

Proof? Well, Torres was allowed to wear whatever she pleased on her collar at any given day - see two bright dashes, two dark ones, or one each, during various first season episodes. The same with "Ensign" Seska who wore the crew insignia... Or all the crew who wore Ensign insigna, take your pick.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oddish]

Every field commission or promotion Janeway doled out was "pretend", when you think about it. Why not a few more for her long-suffering ensigns?

 

[Charles Phipps]

Oh, Torres' rank always was make-believe only. The Maquis got pretty neck ornaments loosely based on their standing in Chakotay's original chain of command - and, separately, Janeway chose a circle of top officers whose rank was of no interest to her (Harry Kim, say).

Proof? Well, Torres was allowed to wear whatever she pleased on her collar at any given day - see two bright dashes, two dark ones, or one each, during various first season episodes. The same with "Ensign" Seska who wore the crew insignia... Or all the crew who wore Ensign insigna, take your pick.

Timo Saloniemi

Nah, that was just cream corn.

 

[oldtrekkie]

Every field commission or promotion Janeway doled out was "pretend", when you think about it. Why not a few more for her long-suffering ensigns?

Plus there are a few lieutenants on board we don't even know exactly how many, so one more isn't gonna hurt, right?

 

[Oddish]

Probably correct. It's impossible to get a coherent list because every Voyager manifest I can find is loaded up with Easter eggs, like "Commander" Rick Berman. But it does seem like every officer above LTJG other than Janeway was killed in transit.

 

[oldtrekkie]

Probably correct. It's impossible to get a coherent list because every Voyager manifest I can find is loaded up with Easter eggs, like "Commander" Rick Berman. But it does seem like every officer above LTJG other than Janeway was killed in transit.

Everyone that openly disliked Tom Paris was killed in the transit. Talk about a bad luck charm.

 

[Oddish]

Liking him, or disliking him?
Dislike him, you die once. Dislike him, and you die repeatedly and your career gets flatlined.
Talk about your kobiashi maru...

 

[Timo]

Probably correct. It's impossible to get a coherent list because every Voyager manifest I can find is loaded up with Easter eggs, like "Commander" Rick Berman. But it does seem like every officer above LTJG other than Janeway was killed in transit.

Luckily, the only Easter eggs that made it to the actual show on screen would have been in "Imperfection", and those Commanders and LCDRs were all casualties. Of the Caretaker, presumably.

Too bad the good old Roll Call page no longer is. The definite count of onscreen characters nicely always came under the explicit 151 limit (although it was actually a close call), and there were no annoyingly protruding Commanders or Grand Admirals there...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Oddish]

That would be awesome if something like that still existed.

 

[Sisko_is_my_captain]

NEELIX: "Hello, Harry. What'll it be today?"

HARRY: "Give me ten bowls of corn."

DATA: "I have never seen anyone eat...ten...bowls of corn."

HARRY: I'm in a really bad mood. And since I've never been promoted before, I should be... very hungry. Hungry for a promotion you understa-"

DATA: I stopped caring approximately 3.464 seconds ago. Please shut up."

 

[Oddish]

Or possibly...

DATA: "My collar is in need of an additional pip as well. Would you be willing to share some corn with me?"

HARRY: "Yeah, sure."

 

[oldtrekkie]

Data: Humans are weird! First I graduated with honors and then was promoted to the rank of lieutenant-commander and was the recipient of a slew of medals for bravery and things like that at which point on a whim some Admiral decided that I should willingly submit to being taken apart and studied by some guy who barely knew what he was doing! Talk about being inconsistent!

 

[Oddish]

HARRY: "You should talk to our doctor. He could tell you some stories."

 

[Oddish]

Something occurred to me... given that LD had one of the Delta Flyer duo in its voice cast, it probably could have gotten two. So why hasn't Harry Kim shown up?

My theory is that there are fans who take a sadistic pleasure at the notion of him being stuck at ensign for his entire career. And there are others who insist that he should have gotten the recognition that his service deserved, that is to say a big fat promotion by the time Voyager reached spacedock (or four or five years before). If they showed him in either state, they'd disappoint one of these factions.

So... no. I doubt we'll ever see Harry on LD (and now that I've said that, he'll probably show up later this season).

 

[Nerys Myk]

Something occurred to me... given that LD had one of the Delta Flyer duo in its voice cast, it probably could have gotten two. So why hasn't Harry Kim shown up?

Was the show canceled? Are they not making anymore?

 

[Oddish]

Was the show canceled? Are they not making anymore?

I thought it was a podcast.