This. Especially when it's not done uniformly or fairly. Tuvok gets a promotion. Tom gets one as well, for a year and a half of "exemplary" service. But Harry, despite six years of equally exemplary service, gets nothing.
Garrett Wang
- Thread starter Athena28
- Start date
- Status
This. Especially when it's not done uniformly or fairly. Tuvok gets a promotion. Tom gets one as well, for a year and a half of "exemplary" service. But Harry, despite six years of equally exemplary service, gets nothing.
Well....I mean...equally exemplary?
I'll let canon answer that one.
In "Twisted", this was said...
JANEWAY (to Kim): "I just want you to know you've been one of the bright spots of this whole mission. You've exceeded any expectations I might have had of you."
And in "Shattered", Chakotay said this to a past version of Janeway...
JANEWAY: "Voyager doesn't have an Astrometrics lab."
CHAKOTAY: "Harry designed it, or will design it."
JANEWAY: "Harry Kim?"
CHAKOTAY: "I realise from your perspective he's new to the job, but he's going to become one of our best people."
And in "The Disease", this comparison of Harry and Tom was made...
JANEWAY: "Probably. But I can't help wondering if my response would have been the same if it had been, say, Tom Paris instead of you. Oh don't get me wrong, I still would have been angry and disappointed, but I wouldn't have been surprised."
KIM: "Because Ensign Kim doesn't break the rules."
Seems pretty clear.
No worries... I enjoyed putting that together.
phooey. The Harry Kim that Starfleet trained died in the line of duty after he was blown out into space because of a hull breach (Deadlock). Starfleet doesn't owe the doppleganger that replaced him jack and that Kim was lucky he was still alive.
Harry died when the hull breached.
Naomi died when her life support failed.
Every other person on Voyager died when Janeway made the ship go boom, after telling the Vidiians "Welcome to the bridge", her second best ever exit line ("Time's up" being #1).
They're all equally dead, and equally alive.
Nope. That Harry Kim was from the Voyager that was being damaged by the proton bursts, hence the original started their repairs first. Wang and McNeill pointed this out in their podcast recap. Wildman and Kim are the only survivors from the original Voyager.phooey. The Harry Kim that Starfleet trained died in the line of duty after he was blown out into space because of a hull breach (Deadlock). Starfleet doesn't owe the doppleganger that replaced him jack and that Kim was lucky he was still alive.
Also, the Vidiians don't detect the duplicate Voyager i.e. the one Harry and Naomi end up escaping to, just the ship that was initially damaging the duplicate with proton bursts.
SEVEN OF NINE LIED!!!!
How did Harry & Seven invent Astrometrics if The Enterprise E had an Astrometics lab?
Seven had recent innovations on file, from Starfleet, that Voyager was unaware of, and she took undeserved credit, because she is Goldilocks.
Last edited:
How do we know which Voyager was the original, or even whether there is an original? Yes, there's the one we follow for most of the episode, but that doesn't mean anything.
I suppose an argument could be made that the one that initiated the proton bursts (the destroyed, Vidiian overrun one) is the original given they started that process, and since they all are duplicate people with the same experiences and memories, the damaged one was slightly behind because it was the copied crew.
Sort of like a copy machine... the original is already there, but the copy is only slightly behind due to the process of being copied.
Sort of like a copy machine... the original is already there, but the copy is only slightly behind due to the process of being copied.
2 ways of looking at it.
1. Antimatter matter can't be duplicated, so the ship with Anti-matter (to begin with) was the original.
2. The original was destroyed, both ships were duplicates, and that's why they had a tug of war with the anti-matter where either ship could have had all of it, when honestly the "original" just was not built like that, with those properties.
Oh...
Personal head canon.
Not a weird random natural space time event. It' a Vidiian Weapon. It's how they kill millions of their space neighbors (every year) without fleets of war ships being deployed to melt the crust of Vidiia.
Its possible that Voyager was duplicated and harvested 100s or thousands of times in the first couple seasons, but they only noticed this time because something weird happened, because of the cloud they were passing through (maybe?) and they saw themselves.
Last edited:
Endlessly being copied and harvested? That sounds like a horror movie to me.
I like it.
Did she invent it? Or just want a lab to measure it?
It's possible that Voyager, having only 15 decks, couldn't have everything the flagship did, so it wasn't outfitted with an astrometrics lab. So, Harry and Seven just retrofitted one in.
Reminds me of a thought I had about a disturbing but funny end for "Favorite Son". Harry gets his DNA "harvested" by two women (instead of three), not quite enough to kill him. So, the Voyager crew Pulaski him with the transporter, using a stored pattern and restoring him to full health but causing him to forget everything. They send him back to Taresia, where two more women are waiting their turn. Rinse and repeat however many times, until Harry has (probably very painfully) fathered hundreds of offspring. Then, they Pulaski him back to full health and leave, making up some excuse with Harry that his genes weren't as compatible as they thought.
The original Voyager is the one that's undamaged for most of the episode, and then is attacked by Vidiians. They were able to start the proton bursts first.
Exactly. The original Voyager was copied, but still had time to start the repairs, unaware of the damage being done to the duplicate. Like, as you say, a copier machine running out of ink despite still working.
Last edited:
Wasn't it the other way around?
The Voyager which was damaged by the proton burst was the original which survived while the Voyager which was destroyed was he copy.
Harry and Naomi in later episodes were copies.
Which is a reason why I always wanted to see a real homecoming for the Voyager crew in the last episodes.
Imagine Harry coming rushing into his parents home, bellowing out the old Runaways and Joan Jett song "Cherry Bomb" with the following lyrics:
"HELLO DAD, HELLO MUM, I'M YOUR D-D-D-D-DUPLICATE SON!"
Why does starting the proton bursts first make them the original? Couldn't that just be luck?
It doesn't matter. At some point before this happened, they were all the same person. The Harry who got sucked out the airlock to his death WAS the Harry who did that cool rolling phaser shot on that Vidiian. So regardless of who was the original and who was the duplicate (if the question can be answered at all), both were quite real. Ergo, the Harry who continued with Voyager was eminently promotable.
Hell, even if you go by Kim's death in "DEADLOCK" making him start over, there was over 2 and 1/2 years between that episode and the beginning of "NIGHT", when Voyager had already spent 2 months in that empty region of space. Plenty of time to go from ensign to Lt. jg, as evidenced by Nog in DS9. (He got that promotion after about a year and 3/4.)
And if they wanted to be
holes and not acknowledge Kim's promotion, it would be the perfect way to do it. Harry just shows up with an extra pip on his collar, and no one even has to mention it.I don't think it's necessarily being an asshole not giving him the promotion on screen.
Worf, Geordi (both promotions), Dax, and Bashir each received their extra hollow pip/full pip between seasons.
Worf, Geordi (both promotions), Dax, and Bashir each received their extra hollow pip/full pip between seasons.
- Status
Similar threads
