Voyager's low ratings...?

[MTA-P]

I am trying to get my head around the narrative that Seven of Nine saved the show. In my opinion, the show improved immensely when she came on, but looking at the viewership numbers, that didn't "save" the show.

In the Nielsen ratings, the pilot was a hit, but the ratings fell from there. It's easy to see from the numbers why they decided the show needed new blood. But again, looking at the Nielsen numbers, that didn't help. Viewership was consistently lower post-seven than before.

If those viewership numbers were low enough to justify a retooling, why weren't they low enough to justify cancellation when that retooling didn't work?

Or put another way, why retool the show when the viewership numbers were apparently acceptable?

Like I said, I think the show was better after she came on, and it was pretty good before. It would've been a tragedy if it had been cancelled. I'm just trying to get my head around why it lasted.

As a Trekkie, not knowing these things is like having an itch I can't scratch.

 

[Akiraprise]

UPN didn't have much else going for it show wise at the time. VOY was their flagship show and in fact helped launch the network. Star Trek was "buzz worthy" and guaranteed eyes, typically, no matter how bad it was.

 

[Oddish]

VOY was in general consider a middling success, at least to the point that it was allowed to end on its own terms, but it staggered across the metaphorical finish line.

Its ratings did get a slight boost during Season 4, perhaps due to Seven... same thing might have happened with DS9 and Worf. It's possible that VOY is considered to have improved as a show due to Seven's presence, resulting in its survival. However, no way of knowing if it would have pulled through with the original cast.

 

[Akiraprise]

The thing with Star Trek is it's like pizza. Even when it's bad it's still usually good.

Back in the late 90s early 00s DS9 and VOY ratings were "good enough." Advertising slots were getting filled and people were still watching. When ENT got cancelled though it seemed as though television was in a period of flux; transitioning to more serialized drama shows and cheap to produce reality television. I don't really buy into the "franchise fatigue" argument. If anything the franchise could have used some new blood and ideas (Manny Coto did great however it was too little too late with UPN execs), but there is always a hunger for decent Trek whether it be on tv or film. Didn't help that UPN was also on the struggle bus then.

 

[drt]

I don't really buy into the "franchise fatigue" argument. If anything the franchise could have used some new blood and ideas

I think the lack of "new blood and ideas" was the franchise fatigue.

 

[Lynx]

VOY was in general consider a middling success, at least to the point that it was allowed to end on its own terms, but it staggered across the metaphorical finish line.

Its ratings did get a slight boost during Season 4, perhaps due to Seven... same thing might have happened with DS9 and Worf. It's possible that VOY is considered to have improved as a show due to Seven's presence, resulting in its survival. However, no way of knowing if it would have pulled through with the original cast.

Stating that "Seven saved the show" was a propaganda lie and nothing more. but I guess that they must have something to come up with to explain why they put Ryan in a catsuit and an excuse for the bad treatment of Lien.

The ratings did rise for a short while after Seven joined but continued to go down after a while.

However, I never understood the panic which was caused by the ratings.

Voyager had good enough ratings during season 1-3 to avoid such panic and even later on it still had a solid fan base to survive for those seven seasons which those in charge were so obsessed with for every series.

I think the lack of "new blood and ideas" was the franchise fatigue.

Yes, but even more the constant sloppy writing.

Ratings:

 

[XCV330]

Most shows start to lose some viewership after awhile. Seven's arrival, along with a little more focus on Doctor probably did stabilize it a little bit. It's subjective but I also think the writing improved, for the most part.

 

[Oddish]

It's subjective but I also think the writing improved, for the most part.

If nothing else, the number of characters they were actually developing doubled.

 

[at Quark's]

My feeling is that somewhere around season 3-4 they gave up trying to create their own 'feel' to the show.

With the introduction of 7, the show became perhaps a bit more consistent in quality, but also a bit more generic and formulaic.

Personally, I think I prefer the earlier years, even though there are some very good voyager episodes from the later seasons.

 

[fireproof78]

Like I said, I think the show was better after she came on, and it was pretty good before. It would've been a tragedy if it had been cancelled. I'm just trying to get my head around why it lasted.

It lasted because UPN was being propped up by the show, and trying to make it work. So, keeping Voyager on while coasting on TNG residuals was the way, which is why Voyager didn't do much with the initial premise, and instead shifted more in to a TNG style episodic format, so that people would tune in to UPN, watching one show, and then not feel like they had to catch up on all Trek history to follow Voyager.

 

[Lynx]

Most shows start to lose some viewership after awhile. Seven's arrival, along with a little more focus on Doctor probably did stabilize it a little bit. It's subjective but I also think the writing improved, for the most part.

If nothing else, the number of characters they were actually developing doubled.

To be honest, I didn't see much development in seasons 4-6 (I never watched season 7, Except for Endgame).

As I see it, neither the writing nor the character development improved. The writing was focused on three characters: Seven, Janeway and The Doctor while the other characters were shoved in the background and the most effort was made to show up Seven from all possible angles in every scene.

The possible "character development" was also focused on threee characters while the other became cardboard cut-outs in the background.

 

[XCV330]

To be honest, I didn't see much development in seasons 4-6 (I never watched season 7, Except for Endgame).

As I see it, neither the writing nor the character development improved. The writing was focused on three characters: Seven, Janeway and The Doctor while the other characters were shoved in the background and the most effort was made to show up Seven from all possible angles in every scene.

The possible "character development" was also focused on threee characters while the other became cardboard cut-outs in the background.

the writers focused on the most interesting characters.I'd say they gave B'elanna good attention too.

Chakotey was a pretendian with all the fascination of watching a box be assembled.
Kes was gone (condolences to all the fans who lost their 5 year old heartthrob and got mad that she came back with some love lines) so doesn't matter.
Paris was a wish.com Kirk. If there had been more dynamic about the Maquis thing, he might have been more interesting. But they buried that plot line immediately and by the time of 7's arrival, he was replaceable.
Kim.. just was.
Neelix was mostly for comic relief, and EMH was better for that kind of thing.
Tuvok is awesome, but they gave him an appropriate amount of time, all things considered.

 

[Lynx]

the writers focused on the most interesting characters.I'd say they gave B'elanna good attention too.

Chakotey was a pretendian with all the fascination of watching a box be assembled.
Kes was gone (condolences to all the fans who lost their 5 year old heartthrob and got mad that she came back with some love lines) so doesn't matter.
Paris was a wish.com Kirk. If there had been more dynamic about the Maquis thing, he might have been more interesting. But they buried that plot line immediately and by the time of 7's arrival, he was replaceable.
Kim.. just was.
Neelix was mostly for comic relief, and EMH was better for that kind of thing.
Tuvok is awesome, but they gave him an appropriate amount of time, all things considered.

I have to disagree here.

The Voyager characters were great to start with and could have been much better if the writers had done a better job. Concentrating the show on the newcomer, the captain and a hologram was basically an insult to the other characters and most of all the actors wh played those characters.

Developing and using the Voyager characters in better ways than they did woold have been better and more beneficial for Voyager. As it was, the show declined instead.

The difference between DS9 and Voyager is that DS) had a bunch of good characters who became better and better while Voyager had a bunch of great characters who were more and less ruined.

 

[Guy Gardener]

The numbers were going down, but Seven bought in a massive influx of new viewers, so maybe only a little more old people where leaving than new people were arriving?

Were the old people leaving because they were done with Star Trek or were the old fans unhappy with the new direction?

So either Seven was marginally scaring off more people than she was attracting, or Seven stopped the ratings from nosediving, and saved the show.

 

[Sumire]

I, to give one example, really liked having the through line of Paris and B’Elanna’s relationship and thought one of the things they had in common was the burden of feeling a parent (or more than one parent) felt they weren’t living up to the standards expected of them as their child. That could have been something they grappled with together, bringing them closer through mutual support rather than the lopsided result we got where most of the depth and connection we fans found was cobbled together from throw away lines of dialogue or episodes that rang the gong of trauma only to have it completely and neatly swept away the very next episode.

If the writers were given more consistent character guidelines to incorporate rather than the “If the plot needs it, you can make them do anything! That good old reset button works for a whole panoply of storytelling elements!” we could have seen some really engaging character growth from a number of people.

 

[ussrowe]

So either Seven was marginally scaring off more people than she was attracting, or Seven stopped the ratings from nosediving, and saved the show.

Yeah that's the thing. All TV shows lose viewers as they go on. It's "audience erosion" you can see it happen with DS9 even though the quality is considered excellent by the fans: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine_episodes#Episodes

Scorpion Part II got 10 million viewers which was more than any episode the previous season got. As the ratings start to settle back down, what's the most watched episode of the next season? Dark Frontier which stars Seven of Nine.

Season 6's 2 most watched episodes are the one with guest stars Barclay and Troi in Pathfinder, and also the one where Seven fights The Rock in Tsukatse.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek:_Voyager_episodes#Episodes

Maybe slowing the show's descent, or being an interesting character that critics enjoyed, is more wordy than "saved"

 

[Dee1891]

Most, if not all TV shows tend to decline in both quality and ratings. I don't know about the ratings, but I thought the writing for most of the Trek shows I have seen had declined in quality over the years, especially during their last or last two seasons. I thought the same would happened to "Voyager" - at least after Season Five. I'm not a big fan of Season Six. But during a recent re-watch, both my sister and I were surprised at how much we had enjoyed Season Seven.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Yeah that's the thing. All TV shows lose viewers as they go on. It's "audience erosion" you can see it happen with DS9 even though the quality is considered excellent by the fans: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine_episodes#Episodes

Scorpion Part II got 10 million viewers which was more than any episode the previous season got. As the ratings start to settle back down, what's the most watched episode of the next season? Dark Frontier which stars Seven of Nine.

Season 6's 2 most watched episodes are the one with guest stars Barclay and Troi in Pathfinder, and also the one where Seven fights The Rock in Tsukatse.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek:_Voyager_episodes#Episodes

Maybe slowing the show's descent, or being an interesting character that critics enjoyed, is more wordy than "saved"

Scorpion II should not count.

They reran Scorpion part one 40 times over summer break, and played the ads for Scorpion II 9000 times across the expanse of three months that Janeway was going to die, and Harry was going to die and this super hot chick was going to do it. Hot people killing each other is tight, but the admen interceded on the private concentration of 5 times as many people and tricked half of them into falsely believing that watching this episode was a fair use of their valuable and limited time.

If they did that for every episode, it would take 6 years to play out one season... Hey! That was The Orville's Shooting Schedule.

 

[ussrowe]

Scorpion II should not count.

But it does.

They reran Scorpion part one 40 times over summer break, and played the ads for Scorpion II 9000 times across the expanse of three months that Janeway was going to die, and Harry was going to die and this super hot chick was going to do it.

Because they had something they could promote: Seven of Nine.

Hence Seven did in fact save Voyager the show. She's even the reason it's popular in reruns: https://vodzilla.co/blog/vod-news/voyager-is-the-most-re-watched-star-trek-series-on-netflix/

As Seven might say, your opinion is irrelevant.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Netflix is not reruns..

Reruns is church.

Having to move your day around, and tell real people that they are less important than being in front of a TV at a specific time of day where upon you will kill any one who tries to interrupt the experience, or you can just turn your phone off for an hour.

Netflix is for losers who can't afford to buy the Blu-rays.