Star Trek: Generations at 30

[Tallguy]

Other than several threads about the OTOY project I have not seen any commemoration of the 30th anniversary of Star Trek: Generations.

Happy Birthday GEN! Or as I like to subtitle it: Two captains. One hairpiece.

I'm pretty sure this is my favorite TNG movie. Yes, I understand its failings. The fight at the end is ridiculous. I have gone from detesting Rene's off screen character motivating death to merely having mixed feelings about it. The Nexus is "like being inside joy" if that means having the dreams that you've only been having for the last couple of days realized and you can shake them off because they obviously aren't real. You can't say that a madman is blowing up planets because he can't get into the Nexus with a spaceship when THREE of your characters make it into the Nexus WITH A SPACESHIP! INCLUDING THE MADMAN!

The problem with Kirk's death is that it is perfunctory. Compare it to Spock or Tony Stark. Spock dies explaining to Kirk what his death meant. Tony dies with one of the greatest "last words" ever. "I. Am. Iron Man." And in both films the rest of the cast then grapples with those deaths. Kirk dies and then the movie just goes on. His death is not the emotional climax of the film. Kirk talked more about the effect of the illusory Abraham Lincoln's death than Picard ever does about Kirk. Picard never mentions Kirk to anyone that we see.

But forget all of that! This movie is big time Star Trek. For all that the accusation gets leveled at Insurrection that it is just a big episode, Generations is actually a BIG episode. In all the best ways. It feels like an episode with the scope and scale of a movie.

The 1701-D is the only series ship that we have seen on the big screen as the main ship. (Sorry, Defiant.) It has the only sets that we have seen on the big screen. The only uniforms. (With a slight nod to the DS9 uniforms.)

Dennis McCarthy is the only Star Trek composer to have been credited for both Star Trek TV shows and a Star Trek movie. (Sorry, I'm not counting Courage and Steiner for their work with Jerry Goldsmith.) And McCarthy totally steps up. I think I like this score better than The Undiscovered Country. (I love The Undiscovered Country.)

Another thing that tends to get missed when talking about watching this movie: Watching it IN THE CINEMA. It was amazing. For one thing the cinematography is gorgeous. I will put this movie up in the top three prettiest Star Trek movies. (The Motion Picture - naturally - and The Voyage Home are the other two. I might include Wrath of Khan as a fourth.)

All the performances are top notch. Except for Beverly. Because they couldn't be bothered to put her in the movie. Although Data pushing her off the ship is the one belly laugh that I get from Data's antics.

I LOVE PICARD AND DEANNA'S SCENE SO MUCH! There is something about her being there that makes Stewart's performance work. When he brushes off his grief and says it's alright and she flat out says (with more than a little disbelief) "It's NOT alright." It took them seven years but she became one of my favorite TNG characters right then.

Brent's gotta Brent but it actually pays off with his scene with Picard in stellar cartography. And it pays off again when he reunites with Geordi.

Shatner is not Kirk in this movie. He's Shatner. But this is what he had been doing since pretty much The Voyage Home so what are you gonna do? But for everything that feels a little limp with his scenes later in the film, his scenes on the Enterprise B crackle.

Oh. Destroying the Enterprise D. It feels REAL. It feels like you are THERE. The saucer separation (despite re-using ILM footage from Farpoint which still looked amazing) feel so visceral. The little girl losing her teddy bear kills me. Geordi having to manage the PEOPLE is one of the moments (after SEVEN YEARS) that really drove home the reality of the D being a floating city. It made me wish that that part of Roddenberry's vision had found flower.

Lifting from another post I made last week:
Developing further what I said previously, Generations is really the only movie to have destroyed THE Enterprise. As much as I adore the refit it is not the ship from TOS and it wasn't where Our Heroes spent years of their lives and we along with them. We never spent that much time with the JJ-prise.

And further points to Generations for the last scene of everybody having to dig things out of their destroyed home. The Star Trek III Enterprise was never really anyone's home. The ship that goes down in Generations is literally Our Ship from Encounter at Farpoint. Same crew, same sets, (mostly) same uniforms.

We might not have grieved for Kirk but we do for the Enterprise.

This is not exactly an Earth shattering assertion but ILM does REALLY good work. There is a solidity and a heft to their spaceship work that is still unequaled. And as good as the work on First Contact is, I think this film beats it.

Anyway. Wow. Thirty years! There are grown people with jobs and maybe even kids who were not alive when this premiered. Generations is currently at the midpoint between the present day and The Cage!

Someone once told me that time is a predator that stalks us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey, and reminds us to cherish every moment. Because they'll never come again. What we leave behind is not as important as how we lived.

 

[Sebine_91]

I love Generations as a TNG send-off, my main issue’s with the Kirk stuff really - such an awful send off for such an iconic character (at least Data’s death ended up being undone - wondered if a Kirk cameo/resurrection was also on the cards when I was watching Picard when it was airing given the easter-egg). Agree the Picard/Troi scene is utterly superb - Sirtis and Stewart hit it out the park. It’s also emotional to see various locations and characters for the last time (I know Goldberg had a cameo in Nemesis) - no more D Bridge, Ten Forward, Engineering, those iconic uniforms, no more TOS cast (until Nimoy in ST 09 anyhoo), no more Guinan properly until Picard.

Rather than passing the baton Generations really feels like the end of an era- I didn’t feel like the other TNG movies really felt like TNG (I think the final season of Picard captured the TNG vibe better than the FC-Nemesis run) - the FC/DS9 uniforms are my least favourite and seem like such a big departure from the TNG ones (the Lower Decks ones seem like a much more natural evolution IMO) and the Enterprise E is less in keeping with the D than the Refit and the A were in the TOS movies in relation to that crew’s original ship. I do love First Contact as a movie though but feel it would have had more impact if the Borg had taken over the D rather than a completely new (to the audience) ship. Plus having to sacrifice the ship to take out the Borg would have been a better send off for the D I feel.

 

[fireproof78]

Generations will always be an interesting film to me. I may say harsher things towards it, but that's only because my connection with it has been a roller coaster.

I didn't grow up with TNG, save for the occasional episode. My biggest connection to it was action figures and All Good Things, which a friend of mine tapped and we rewatched again and again.

So, when Generations rolled around I was actually pretty interested in seeing this bridge between crews. The Enterprise B segment was really enjoyable, and kind of meta because I never grew up with TOS as it aired but only in reruns, so Harriman's comment about "studying Kirk's missions" felt kind of like my life.

But, the TNG part was always mixed to me. I enjoyed Riker, and Troi and Picard's moment discussing his losses was quite moving. But, I found Data and Geordi quite annoying. The Enterprise D crashing was almost unmoving to me because the action of the film doesn't linger on it. We see the crash, we have Data's quip, and then back to Picard and Kirk. It's odd.

Kirk's death is not one I linger on. I think it doesn't work on one level, and yet his scene dying with Picard is still very moving, and I feel that. As well as Picard's comments at the end.

Overall, it's an ok film. I don't think it drives anything forward, but it makes for a good adventure.

 

[The Wormhole]

Generations has always held a special place in my heart mostly on account of it being the first Trek movie I saw in theatres. And as a kid I loved it. I saw it three times in theatres, making it one of the rare movies I've seen more than once in the theatre. Even today (or especially today?) I don't do that.

Sure, as an adult I can look at the movie and realize how flawed it is. It does feel in some ways like an extended length TNG episode with a bloated budget. The opening twenty minutes on the Enterprise B are odd in relation to the movie overall, as aside from establishing Kirk's fate it has no real relevance to the rest of the film. Having the Enterprise D's lights off creates a weird look and Data's emotion chip does become a bit of a distraction at times. And it suffers the same problem as all the TNG films in that aside from Picard and Data, everyone else in the TNG cast is superfluous. But you know what? I don't care. The film is enjoyable all the same and is my Go To if all I'm looking for is empty nostalgia.

 

[Dukhat]

Like most fans, I enjoyed the movie when it came out. I mean, it was every TNG fan's dream to see these characters and the Enterprise-D on the big screen, am I right? Even though the morons who edited the teaser commercials spoiled everything by showing the Enterprise-D's destruction ahead of time.

It was only later, when the next TNG films started having diminishing returns, that I started to re-evaluate Generations, and realized that while there were some good moments in the film, they were vastly superseded by the frankly nonsensical plot and the laundry list of Paramount-demanded edicts. I won't list them here, because everybody already knows what they are. But I will list the few things that ultimately got me the most annoyed:

-Making Harriman out to look like a complete imbecile in front of his entire crew just for the sake of making Kirk look relevant.

-The complete waste of budget money on the pointless holodeck sailing ship Enterprise scene. Sure it was a visual treat, but it was for Worf's promotion, which had nothing whatsoever to do with the plot of the story, and only served to make Riker look like an asshole. Sure, it also started the Data-emotion-chip plot, but did they have to spend all that money for that?

-Picard's brother and nephew dying in the most horrible way possible, and then completely glossing over that awful incident by the end of the film, because it was just a plot device.

-The Enterprise-D taken out by a Bird-of-Prey.

-The whole ridiculousness of the Nexus. Never mind any technical aspects of it; the whole movie is predicated on Guinan's warning that it is so addictive that you'll never want to leave, and yet Picard and Kirk leave it just fine.

-The utterly stupid way in which Kirk died. And then they just left him there buried at the top of a mountain rather than taking his body with them when they got rescued.

-Picard carelessly tossing away his priceless Kurlan Naiskos for his family album. Sure, Jean-Luc, I get that it's important to you, but did you forget where that incredibly rare alien artifact came from? I know this is a small peeve, but it really annoyed me.

 

[Tallguy]

Even though the morons who edited the teaser commercials spoiled everything by showing the Enterprise-D's destruction ahead of time.

Go back and look at the Star Trek III trailer. GEN was positively misleading by comparison.

Oh, I still smile when I thought while I was watching it "Oh! Time loopy stuff. They're not REALLY going to crash the Enterprise! Clever." Cut back from the Nexus: "Annnnd we're still crashing!"

Harriman was just the latest in a long line of "Our Heroes aren't just the best, the rest of Starfleet are morons." (Again, Star Trek III.)

 

[sonak]

This movie is great! It’s got a fantastic score, it’s visually impressive, and it’s got a lot of humor. Malcolm Mcdowell gives a great performance and Soren is a unique vilain in the Trek film series. I don’t think they had to do a “crossover” movie for the first TNG film( First Contact showed that the TNG cast could carry a movie on their own very well) but this pulled it off nicely considering all of the other stuff jammed in the movie along with Kirk and Picard meeting.

 

[NCC-73515]

The movie that got a TIME cover. I was hoping for something more epic or profound when those two meet, instead we got a cooking show. Kirk and Picard team up to.... make eggs.
The nexus wife could've been Beverly, or the glowing egg lady, or Nella. Hey perhaps even the Inner Light wife
In the audio comments, they said they regret having Picard cry, but I think that was exactly the right choice. In the 24th century, men can cry, especially when something tragic happened.
When the D was destroyed, I was very sad. The E quickly replaced her as the greatest looking ship, but when the D was resurrected in PIC, it was like an old wound from 94 was finally healed.

 

[Dukhat]

Go back and look at the Star Trek III trailer. GEN was positively misleading by comparison.

Oh, I agree. Showing the Enterprise's saucer exploding and the ship falling toward the Genesis planet in the trailer completely negated the shock value of that surprise.

Malcolm Mcdowell gives a great performance and Soren is a unique vilain in the Trek film series.

McDowell was the best thing about the movie. He's a great actor and his motivations for being the 'bad guy' were completely convincing (despite the Nexus itself being a pretty stupid plot device.)

 

[CoveTom]

I mentioned this in another thread, but I must be the only one who dislikes the cinematography in Generations. I hate, hate, hate the lighting. Detest. Cinematic my butt. Turn on a light, for goodness sakes. It looks ridiculous.

On the other hand, I adore the stellar cartography set they built and think it's a shame we only got to see it once.

Overall, though, I have more problems with it than I have praise. Kirk's death was handled badly. The epic meeting of the two captains was cooking breakfast. The destruction of the Enterprise-D was handled badly and was also pointless. (Although I must admit that the sequence of the saucer crash is one of the best effects I've ever seen on film.) The Data comedy runner was just absolutely painful. And so on.

 

[SithHappens]

I still enjoy this film, it's in my top 2 or 3 to rewatch.

Every time I watch though I still hope Kirk survives. I still never get why there was such a desire to write off the old cast. I still think most of them could have featured in some way in later films or series, I still harbor hopes Shatner will make one final appearance.

 

[CoveTom]

I still enjoy this film, it's in my top 2 or 3 to rewatch.

Every time I watch though I still hope Kirk survives. I still never get why there was such a desire to write off the old cast. I still think most of them could have featured in some way in later films or series, I still harbor hopes Shatner will make one final appearance.

I agree. I found it so refreshing when Terry Matalas said, after Picard season 3 had aired, that he couldn't bring himself to kill off any of the TNG characters and that he doesn't understand why writers want to kill off their heroes.

 

[Admiral Archer]

Generations was my introduction to William Shatner's Captain James T. Kirk. I was only five years old, so you could forgive me for thinking TNG was the first Star Trek, and Picard was the first captain. You can rest assured once I realized there was a whole other Star Trek series before TNG, I made it a priority to watch that original show. And I fell in love with it. For that reason alone Generations, in spite of my distaste for it, will always be a historical footnote in my time as a trekkie.

 

[Jedi Marso]

I still think the novel 'Federation' by the Reeves-stevens should have been the crossover movie.

Generations was okay, but not even as good as All Good Things.

 

[Dukhat]

I still think the novel 'Federation' by the Reeves-stevens should have been the crossover movie.

Meh, Federation was a good book (and a better story than Generations), but it was too bogged down with TOS minutiae for the casual moviegoer to be able to really appreciate it. And the original actors who played Cochrane and Flint would not be able to suddenly go back in time 30 years, since the book clearly meant to acknowledge them. Do you really see James Cromwell acting like the Cochrane in the book?

The biggest flaw of Generations is that it wasn't a movie that was 'general audience' friendly. It was made specifically for Star Trek fans only. That really limits the amount of moviegoers' asses in theater seats. There once was a time when everyone, Trek fan or not, went to see Star Trek films. Until JJ Abrams came along, that wasn't happening anymore. And I wonder if it will ever happen again.

 

[StarTrek1701]

One of my fav movies actually, can't believe its 30 years already.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

I still think the novel 'Federation' by the Reeves-stevens should have been the crossover movie.

I love Federation. To me, October-November '94 is Star Trek's absolute peak, because we had Federation in October (it came out about six weeks before the film), then Generations in November (there's an epilogue in Federation that contextualizes Generations), plus DC and Malibu had their TNG/DS9 crossover comic, and Malibu was doing some interesting stuff to contextualize Generations within DS9 as well (Lightstorm). And Voyager was coming. It all felt like something big.

Generations was okay, but not even as good as All Good Things.

"All Good Things" would have been a better movie. And a better crossover movie. I'd know how I'd do it. Instead of Picard going back to "Farpoint," Q does a Quantum Leap thing and send him back to the Enterprise-A after Star Trek VI. The future would be much further in the future, like maybe the -G or -H, and we (and Picard) would only see hallucinogenic glimpses of it.

Do you really see James Cromwell acting like the Cochrane in the book?

I know Cochrane in First Contact was offered to Tom Hanks, but it clashed with filming for That Thing You Do. I wonder, though, how much of Cochrane was written for Hanks, because it really seems to me like Cochrane is basically Walter from The Money Pit. Did Berman hear Hanks might be interested in the 30th-anniversary film, so Braga and Moore started writing Cochrane like a late 80s Hanks comedic character?

The biggest flaw of Generations is that it wasn't a movie that was 'general audience' friendly. It was made specifically for Star Trek fans only.

Very much so. It's not just that I think Generations needed a rewrite, it needed a page one rewrite from someone way outside of the Paramount lot and the Star Trek writers rooms.

 

[Turtletrekker]

If I recall correctly, the reason for the dark lighting was the fact that the sets were over 7 years old, and while they looked fine on a television screen, they looked shabby on the big screen. Hence, the low lighting.

 

[Jedi Marso]

Do you really see James Cromwell acting like the Cochrane in the book?

Until the casting of Kirk in SNW, Cromwell as Zephram Cochrane might have been the biggest miscast in all of Trek history, AFAIC. Not that I expected Glenn Corbett himself to reprise the role, but Jeez what an assrape of TOS that whole bit was. Worst element of an otherwise good movie by far.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Until the casting of Kirk in SNW, Cromwell as Zephram Cochrane might have been the biggest miscast in all of Trek history, AFAIC. Not that I expected Glenn Corbett himself to reprise the role, but Jeez what an assrape of TOS that whole bit was. Worst element of an otherwise good movie by far.

Look, Braga thought Cochrane could be Picard's love interest in the film. Moore had to politely tell him that wouldn't work. That's the level of knowledge we're dealing with here.