Star Trek Legends.

[fireproof78]

As for the Warp Drive thing, honestly, I'm wondering why this is such a specific issue? FTL (or other tech) is a cheat to provide more worlds to explore. If it isn't warp drive, then do we use wormholes or jump gates? The concepts all exist in other franchises, so eliminating this one seems rather odd, to me.

Because it's use has been excessive and greedy.

Why do we need access to 1,000,000,000 million stars if we can't find the ones in direct interest of value.

The need to avoid ftl isn't just about scientific realism, its about whether or not the tech helps to achieve the backdrop to storytelling of star trek.

And it generally cause a trek universe where literally every corner of the galaxy is filled with rubber forehead aliens.

Which this concept one can essentially goto 10 times the speed of light(relative to the people on the ship).

This to me seems like a fair pace if you want to actually focus on exoplanets, and nearby solar systems.

With a pacing that allows for 2 solar systems per season, each having multiple planets I think it's irrational to say there are not enough worlds.

The added benefit of having relativity limitations is that it's far easier for the viewer to really understand the degree to which each mission is truly experiencing the unknown.

Angain another doubling down is that there is a degree of traveling in both time and space as due to time dilation the crew will get to travel over a century forward into the future. Allowing for the people to make first contact to also be whiteness to their own celebrity by the millions of federation colonist that follow in their foot steps.


Again another advantage is the idea of the federation existing with no instantaneous communication. When one is isolated from their own time, the importance of loyalty to a grand galactic government only comes with more value.

While it is an interesting concept, I don't agree with the premise that FLT is overused, so I find the need to reduce it's effectiveness to be unusual.

Also, while I appreciate the concept of time dilation due to FTL I can see it forcing a disconnect between Starfleet officers and Federation colonies, since they won't really be able to connect with individuals there, since who they meet there may be dead before they see them again. In other words, every trip is a one way trip.

In other words, it is the experience of a soldier going on a combat mission made 100 times worse. The commitment the Federation's exploration mission is a lifetime one, it seems to me.

Sorry, for me, there are a lot of unintended consequences in this FTL concept.

 

[Squiggy]

Sign up for Starfleet. Explore a strange new world. Never see your friends or family again!

 

[Autistoid]

Sign up for Starfleet. Explore a strange new world. Never see your friends or family again!

That to me doesn't see like too much of a divergence of what you'd expect of one who is travelling into space, that is of course ignoring the likely hood that your loved ones would be on a very concurrent path.

 

[Autistoid]

Also, while I appreciate the concept of time dilation due to FTL I can see it forcing a disconnect between Starfleet officers and Federation colonies, since they won't really be able to connect with individuals there, since who they meet there may be dead before they see them again. In other words, every trip is a one way trip.

In other words, it is the experience of a soldier going on a combat mission made 100 times worse. The commitment the Federation's exploration mission is a lifetime one, it seems to me.

Sorry, for me, there are a lot of unintended consequences in this FTL concept.

I think what you will see is in fact that because of the isolation in time, people actually gravitate to default loyalties.

imagine being thrown 20 years into the future, would you not gravitate to your own national heritage as a method of maintaining consistency.

I think this is what you see in immigrant communities when trust across the world they naturally gravitate to their own people.

The unintended consequence is that one is able to borrow much from voyager in terms of lost in space. As well as a large degree of generational difference between tng and tos.

Did I mention pseudo time travel.


Keeping in mind the jumps would be relatively minor distances.

several lightyears at a time.

 

[BillJ]

Sign up for Starfleet. Explore a strange new world. Never see your friends or family again!

That to me doesn't see like too much of a divergence of what you'd expect of one who is travelling into space, that is of course ignoring the likely hood that your loved ones would be on a very concurrent path.

Except that isn't "Star Trek". Star Trek has used family and running into recurrent characters time and again.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I've had this strange habit, lately, of entering the Future of Trek forum and somehow winding up in Fan Fiction. It's like someone changed the labels on the doors or something.

 

[fireproof78]

Also, while I appreciate the concept of time dilation due to FTL I can see it forcing a disconnect between Starfleet officers and Federation colonies, since they won't really be able to connect with individuals there, since who they meet there may be dead before they see them again. In other words, every trip is a one way trip.

In other words, it is the experience of a soldier going on a combat mission made 100 times worse. The commitment the Federation's exploration mission is a lifetime one, it seems to me.

Sorry, for me, there are a lot of unintended consequences in this FTL concept.

I think what you will see is in fact that because of the isolation in time, people actually gravitate to default loyalties.

imagine being thrown 20 years into the future, would you not gravitate to your own national heritage as a method of maintaining consistency.

I think this is what you see in immigrant communities when trust across the world they naturally gravitate to their own people.

The unintended consequence is that one is able to borrow much from voyager in terms of lost in space. As well as a large degree of generational difference between tng and tos.

Did I mention pseudo time travel.


Keeping in mind the jumps would be relatively minor distances.

several lightyears at a time.

I do not agree on the assessment of unintended consequences.

First of all, by becoming more isolated from family and friends you are automatically more nationalistic? Am I reading that correctly?

If so, then that heads down an interesting psychological path that does not necessarily end well. For starters, by isolating Starfleet personnel, you are creating a warrior class that has little to no connection to the people or worlds that they are supposed to be protecting. In other words, Starfleet officers sacrifice a lot and come to resent the worlds they are protecting because they don't recognize the sacrifices being made out in space. Yes, yes, I know, it's utopia and people willingly make the sacrifice.

It feels to disconnected to me for it to be meaningful to the crew of this ship.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

A thought has just occurred to me. How do they become 'legends'?

By ship time it will take them months between star systems, whilst on Earth it will be years, so what is an 18 month trip on the ship doing all their typical day-to-day normal operations might be 18 years back home with no updates, discoveries or alien contact, it would seem to Joe Bloggs that they aren't actually doing much of worth.

Ok they may (to steal a line from ENT [/shudder]) "be making history with every light-year", but the same thing could be accomplished with unmanned 'warp' probes--which would be safer and not involve the emotional and psychological problems such a (essentially 'one way') mission would incur on the crew.

 

[Autistoid]

I've had this strange habit, lately, of entering the Future of Trek forum and somehow winding up in Fan Fiction. It's like someone changed the labels on the doors or something.

Funny when I came here I thought I ended up in the past of star trek, because all anyone was talking about was what has already happened.

I think trek deserves to be reimagined I make little apoligee for that.

For me ST09 is a blantant reboot, and all crap that it isn't is just fan porn.

If you have better ideas for how that will be done, I"m all ears. Reboot or not the franchise formula has to be updated.

 

[Autistoid]

A thought has just occurred to me. How do they become 'legends'?

By ship time it will take them months between star systems, whilst on Earth it will be years, so what is an 18 month trip on the ship doing all their typical day-to-day normal operations might be 18 years back home with no updates, discoveries or alien contact, it would seem to Joe Bloggs that they aren't actually doing much of worth.

Ok they may (to steal a line from ENT [/shudder]) "be making history with every light-year", but the same thing could be accomplished with unmanned 'warp' probes--which would be safer and not involve the emotional and psychological problems such a (essentially 'one way') mission would incur on the crew.

Your making some false assumption, for 1 18 months would be more like 15 years.

Two, you ignoring the ammount of time they would have spent stopped in solars systems. I.e. I'd expect 2-3 months per solar system that the hit. So when you add it all up it'd be closer to 3 years to go 15 years into the future.

Three, your assuming other ships wouldnt' be retracing their foot steps. Although they may be 15 years ahead of their time it'd be likely they'd also run into ships that are 12-10 years ahead of their time. So the preception of distance would be much smaller.

This is especially important if you realize that colony ships can carry out family members.

So the idea that it's strickly one way is an exaggeration.

 

[Autistoid]

First of all, by becoming more isolated from family and friends you are automatically more nationalistic? Am I reading that correctly?

If so, then that heads down an interesting psychological path that does not necessarily end well. For starters, by isolating Starfleet personnel, you are creating a warrior class that has little to no connection to the people or worlds that they are supposed to be protecting. In other words, Starfleet officers sacrifice a lot and come to resent the worlds they are protecting because they don't recognize the sacrifices being made out in space. Yes, yes, I know, it's utopia and people willingly make the sacrifice.

It feels to disconnected to me for it to be meaningful to the crew of this ship.

A warrior class no.

Do you have any experince with immigrants.

It's totally part of the process that you loose all contact with your family unless they to make the journey.

It's part of life. Obviously it's not gonna be ships full of people leaving their kids behind, it's gonna be people that are mostly single or have their families in close sucession on colony ships. Much as it ever was in trek.

I think what your missing is how much the federation and earth would be an anchor for people on the ship.

They aren't making a one way trip to no where. They are expecting very much to spend their lives on a federation colony once they have been established.

A typical career mission would be a 20 light year trip. Totaling up to about 5 years time for the people on the ship. When these people settle on a nice star base they would in fact be only 10 years ahead of people on that colony as it too would be 10 lightyears from earth.

Of course it would be different for our main cast but that's what would make them legends.

 

[fireproof78]

Ok, interesting concept, but not for me.

Thanks for clarifying.

 

[Squiggy]

A typical career mission would be a 20 light year trip.

There are 1-8 stars within 20 light years of Earth that could support life. As of now, there are only 6 planets within 20 light years of Earth that are habitable. Sort of limits your options.

I hope you're also going to have subspace radio... because Earth would never hear about these exploits for the crews to become legends otherwise.

 

[T'Girl]

As I said it'd take more like 18 months ship time.

At your "warp nine" of 0.9111 of light, the time dilation would about two and a half to one. Two and a half days on Earth, one day on the ship.

At 0.9111 of light, the sixteen light year journey to Vulcan would take seventeen and a half years Earth time, and seven years ship time. Round trip for the ship's crew fourteen years, plus the time they spend on Vulcan.

From the prospective of someone on Earth, the journey was over thirty-five years.

 

[Autistoid]

A typical career mission would be a 20 light year trip.

There are 1-8 stars within 20 light years of Earth that could support life. As of now, there are only 6 planets within 20 light years of Earth that are habitable. Sort of limits your options.

I hope you're also going to have subspace radio... because Earth would never hear about these exploits for the crews to become legends otherwise.

Using severly limited conventional methods, assuming there is no terraforming, and that the only intereting habitat are planets that look the foot hills of vancouver or the california desert.

 

[Autistoid]

As I said it'd take more like 18 months ship time.

At your "warp nine" of 0.9111 of light, the time dilation would about two and a half to one. Two and a half days on Earth, one day on the ship.

At 0.9111 of light, the sixteen light year journey to Vulcan would take seventeen and a half years Earth time, and seven years ship time. Round trip for the ship's crew fourteen years, plus the time they spend on Vulcan.

From the prospective of someone on Earth, the journey was over thirty-five years.

My math is off i did it in my head however your formula seems to be wrong.

 

[fireproof78]

A typical career mission would be a 20 light year trip.

There are 1-8 stars within 20 light years of Earth that could support life. As of now, there are only 6 planets within 20 light years of Earth that are habitable. Sort of limits your options.

I hope you're also going to have subspace radio... because Earth would never hear about these exploits for the crews to become legends otherwise.

Using severly limited conventional methods, assuming there is no terraforming, and that the only intereting habitat are planets that look the foot hills of vancouver or the california desert.

We are talking about a science fiction TV show with real actors and the like. Budgeting must always be a consideration.

 

[T'Girl]

At 0.9111 of light, the sixteen light year journey to Vulcan would take seventeen and a half years Earth time, and seven years ship time. Round trip for the ship's crew fourteen years, plus the time they spend on Vulcan.

From the prospective of someone on Earth, the journey was over thirty-five years.

My math is off i did it in my head however your formula seems to be wrong.

All righty then.

0.9111 times the speed of light is 169,722 miles per second (or if you prefer 273,141 kilometres per second).

The relativistic change factor would be exactly 2.426092824060471 (which I did previously round off to 2.5).

Which star in the sky is Vulcan's homestar is a matter of some debate, however 40 Eridani is commonly considered Vulcan's homestar. The distance to 40 Eridani is 16.45 light years (plus or minus 0.07 LY). I previously rounded this off to 16 LY.

At 0.9111 time the speed of light, the 16.45 light year journey to 40 Eridani would take 18.055 years Earth time, and 7.442 years ship time. Round trip for the ship's crew would be 14.884 years, plus whatever time they spend in the star system.

This assumes that the ship immediately reaches 0.9111 at the beginning of the journey, and immediately stops at the destination, which I believe you stipulated.

From the prospective of someone on Earth, the journey would have been 36.110 years.

And these numbers are right.

.









.

 

[BillJ]

We are talking about a science fiction TV show with real actors and the like. Budgeting must always be a consideration.

"This isn't reality. ...This is fantasy." - Commander Uhura, Star Trek III: The Search for Spock.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?
Caught in a landslide
No escape from reality
Open your eyes
Look up to the skies and see

-Bohemian Rhapsody, Queen