nog's promotions

[JRoss]

Sisko certainly was a commodore. He was a captain who was seen to have command over multiple ships at once. We see him ordering battle groups around from his office. Dax may not have received a promotion because full commander is a more demanding job than just a regular lieutenant. You'll find lots of little lieutenants but far fewer commanders around.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Also Ezri didn't exactly perform above and beyond the call of duty. The only one of her career-related successes on the show (Garak) was more something she insecurely fumbled around and lucked into. You don't get a Counselor promotion for solving a murder in a bad CSI episode or going rogue to save your previous host's husband.

Her hard work started after the war was over with thousands of PTSD patients.

 

[Spike730]

It's about Jadzia, not Ezri.

 

[Squiggy]

Sisko certainly was a commodore.

No. He wasn't. He died a captain and the rank doesn't exist.

He was a captain who was seen to have command over multiple ships at once. We see him ordering battle groups around from his office.

Bully for him. That doesn't make him a commodore anymore than a lieutenant sitting in the big chair makes one a commander or captain.

You'd think that if he was a commodore (or any other rank), he'd...I don't know...wear the rank or be referred to as commodore at least once?

Dax may not have received a promotion because full commander is a more demanding job than just a regular lieutenant. You'll find lots of little lieutenants but far fewer commanders around.

Yes. That's the entire point of ranks.

 

[dub]

He died

Nope.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Sisko certainly was a commodore.

No. He wasn't. He died a captain and the rank doesn't exist.

What about Commodore Wesley?

Also, from memory alpha (somewhat contradictory to itself)

The first mention of the rank of commodore in Star Trek: The Next Generation occurred in the episode "Conspiracy". In that episode, several commodores were issuing commands in mission orders to starship captains. These orders were read by Lieutenant Commander Data in the android's investigation into a suspected conspiracy among the higher members of Starfleet Command.
The La Forge calling Bochra "commodore" was the only time that the rank was ever spoken of in dialogue in the series.

 

[JRoss]

In the current U.S. navy there are "commodores", it's not a rank, but a position. It's held by senior captains with command over more than one ship. That's exactly what Sisko was doing.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

In the current U.S. navy there are "commodores", it's not a rank, but a position. It's held by senior captains with command over more than one ship. That's exactly what Sisko was doing.

I had said earlier, the Navy had Commodore as a rank, then dropped it. It could be "Fleet Captain" as well, I think those two are pretty much the same.

I guess if they didn't make these changes from time to time, the government people who make those earth shattering decisions wouldn't have jobs.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

It's about Jadzia, not Ezri.

Then why are we talking about who should have been promoted at the end?

 

[Squiggy]

In the current U.S. navy there are "commodores", it's not a rank, but a position. It's held by senior captains with command over more than one ship. That's exactly what Sisko was doing.

Then he was referred to as Commodore?

 

[Bad Thoughts]

In the current U.S. navy there are "commodores", it's not a rank, but a position. It's held by senior captains with command over more than one ship. That's exactly what Sisko was doing.

Then he was referred to as Commodore?

JRoss is speaking of functionality, not being literal.

 

[USS Triumphant]

The rank of Commodore in the United States Navy was replaced/renamed to Rear Admiral (lower half). Given that Sisko was answering directly to a Vice Admiral, it's possible that many of the writers thought (as I did) that the commander of a starbase should be at least a Commodore, both because of tradition (TOS) and because logistically, the commander of a starbase needs the captains of ships docked there to respect his/her authority.

 

[kkt]

Sisko should have been a commodore at the beginning of the series. Command of the station is much more complex than a starship, even if the number of Starfleet personnel Sisko commanded at the beginning was smaller. DS9 has a mixed Starfleet/Bajoran crew, a large number of civilians, a non-Federation government to work with, many ships from many jurisdictions calling. Much more complicated than a single Starfleet ship. By the middle of DS9's run, they were saying the station's population was several thousand. By then, it should have been an admiral's command. And certainly in season 7 when Sisko was directing a fleet of several hundred ships, he should have had two stars if not three.

Nog's promotions seem about right to me. Junior officers' first promotions occur faster than senior officer's promotions, and Nog put in a lot of time on the Defiant's bridge in battle and did very well.

 

[Nick086]

If they need more officers they could of simply promoted O'Brien to a a full Lieutenant since he fought in the Dominion War. Chief O'Brien had the very same experience before fighting in the Cardassian War. They pretty much did this in many armies of the world start off as a private, sailor, and airman. When war comes around promotions come quick and for some they become junior officers Ensigns and Lieutenants to fill in the spots because there is a need of junior officers. Since a lot of them are fresh and don't have the experience in combat they might be to easy pick off and that can go for the privates, sailors, and airmen as well.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

If they need more officers they could of simply promoted O'Brien to a a full Lieutenant since he fought in the Dominion War. Chief O'Brien had the very same experience before fighting in the Cardassian War. They pretty much did this in many armies of the world start off as a private, sailor, and airman. When war comes around promotions come quick and for some they become junior officers Ensigns and Lieutenants to fill in the spots because there is a need of junior officers. Since a lot of them are fresh and don't have the experience in combat they might be to easy pick off and that can go for the privates, sailors, and airmen as well.

We did have an officer O'Brien in TNG, who daydreamed in his "favorite transporter room." Senior NCO O'Brien had much more (indirect) authority (out of recognition of experience) and played more pivotal roles in the life of the station and the Defiant. Of course, we don't know how the difference between senior NCO and junior officer plays out in the ST universe. I would guess that some opportunities were open to O'Brien if he were an NCO and not an officer. He might have manned opps for seven years on an Intrepid-class ship without promotion.

 

[drmick]

Sisko should have been a commodore at the beginning of the series. Command of the station is much more complex than a starship, even if the number of Starfleet personnel Sisko commanded at the beginning was smaller. DS9 has a mixed Starfleet/Bajoran crew, a large number of civilians, a non-Federation government to work with, many ships from many jurisdictions calling. Much more complicated than a single Starfleet ship. By the middle of DS9's run, they were saying the station's population was several thousand. By then, it should have been an admiral's command. And certainly in season 7 when Sisko was directing a fleet of several hundred ships, he should have had two stars if not three.

Nog's promotions seem about right to me. Junior officers' first promotions occur faster than senior officer's promotions, and Nog put in a lot of time on the Defiant's bridge in battle and did very well.

I'm pretty sure main reason he wasn't captain in first place was because he needed to be outranked by Picard for those few scenes in Emissary.

Although to be fair, TNG had already set the standard of starbases having commander ranks as the lead officer, even ancient ones!

 

[Captain Kathryn]

I think it was just a way to write Nog into the war arc/missions as an officer.

 

[Timo]

I don't see them thinking quite that way. It's more like "Hey, wouldn't it be cool if Nog went to Starfleet Academy?", followed by "Drats, we need Nog back for our Jake stories - perhaps he should graduate early or something". If they could, they would have taken him back just as he was, the annoying son of an idiot savant and nephew of an affable rascal and that's it. But they were stuck with him being an officer now.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Durek]

Functionally though, she had to outrank Dax (and then Worf) as the otherwise most senior officer on DS9, so in practice Major would be at least equivalent to a Lieutenant Commander under normal circumstances. By the top of season seven, she was promoted in Sisko's absence and was in charge of DS9, so Colonel SHOULD be equivalent to Commander at least to hold that position over Dax and Worf without anyone at Starfleet being worried about chain of command. She maintained that rank when Sisko returned, and it wouldn't make sense to DEMOTE her when she was put into symbolic service, so I'm happy thinking Colonel is the equivalent of a Starfleet commander and they just breveted her accordingly when she had to slip on their oh-so-colourful threads.

Mark

Actually Colonel would be equivalent to Captain. A LIEUTENANT Colonel is equivalent to a Commander. This of course is going by the US Military rank structure which Starfleet is based on (US Navy to be exact). I guess they didn't want more than one captain again like in the original series movies.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

That is being based on a human ranking system.

In the Bajoran Militia there was a one-episode character referred to as Ensign, whilst the rank of Lieutenant Colonel has never been mentioned.

For all we know the ranks are:
Colonel (Starfleet Captain)
Major (SF Commander)
Captain (SF Lieutenant Commander)
First Lieutenant (SF Lieutenant)
Second Lieutenant (SF Lieutenant JG)
Ensign (SF Ensign)

This way, Kira may have always held the same rank as Sisko, but would defer to him as he was her Commanding Officer.