It's pretty obvious DIS Season Two was redesigned halfway through. The Red Angel becomes something very different at the end than at the beginning. But what was the original plan -if there was one- and why did it change?
Discovery Season Two: What Happened?
- Thread starter Tiran O'Saurus
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I ruminated about essentially the same question the other day in another thread. Basically what happened is that the head writers of the show, Gretchen Berg and Aaron Harberts, were fired from the show five episodes into the second season, which likely means their original vision was changed by the writers taking their place.
Still, looking back I would have to say the second season remains my favorite of the show so far. It’s where I felt the show and the characters came into their own. Bringing in Spock and the Enterprise crew worked much better than I think the idea did on paper. And I think much of that can be attributed to the portrayal of both Ethan Peck and Anson Mount.
Still, looking back I would have to say the second season remains my favorite of the show so far. It’s where I felt the show and the characters came into their own. Bringing in Spock and the Enterprise crew worked much better than I think the idea did on paper. And I think much of that can be attributed to the portrayal of both Ethan Peck and Anson Mount.
Writers were fired.
So, they took the story elements and reworked them, which resulted in some storylines feeling a bit lost.
Originally, it was supposed to be a faith vs. science type storyline. It didn't go beyond that in terms of the plan.
Yeah, it's painfully obvious the production was forced to retool everything because it would have been problematic to pay Berg and Harberts for use of their story elements to conclude the season.
I'm really curious how the story was supposed to have played out, my assumption is that the Red Angel would never be fully explained, and the choice would eventually be either some manner of advanced, Preservers-like race (science) or some kind of supernatural entity (faith). I think it would have been more thought-provoking than "good thing Burnham's mom invented a time-traveling supersuit just in time to save us from an evil AI". Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever get a "behind-the-scenes" book that will detail the initial plan.
I'm really curious how the story was supposed to have played out, my assumption is that the Red Angel would never be fully explained, and the choice would eventually be either some manner of advanced, Preservers-like race (science) or some kind of supernatural entity (faith). I think it would have been more thought-provoking than "good thing Burnham's mom invented a time-traveling supersuit just in time to save us from an evil AI". Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever get a "behind-the-scenes" book that will detail the initial plan.
That was always what I suspected the original plan was going to be as well. They tried to tie it all together at the end, with one or two lines from Burnham talking vaguely about faith, but you could just tell they were straining to bring the plot to a conclusion. I wish season 2 turned out differently, it could've been something that Trek hadn't done before.
You can definitely see religious themes prominent in the early episodes of the season, most obviously in New Eden, though one can also make an argument that the episode about the Sphere depicts the Sphere as a sort of God parallel. I remember hearing rumors circulating before the season premiered indicating that Pike was going to be depicted as a very religious man. I wonder if this was part of the original Harberts and Berg plan? Though not depicted as being a believer of any sort of religious ideology in the season 2 that aired (or in SNW, for that matter) Pike does seem particularly knowledgeable on religious matters in New Eden, most notably he explains the history of why churches have stained glass windows.
Presumably that was part of the original plan.
I'd bet the idea was that Pike would be a man of faith, but not one who felt the need to jam his beliefs down other's throats, but would act as a foil for the Vulcan-schooled Burnham.
I vote for liking the new direction better.
Trek generally does not have a good or consistent record with themes of faith. There is a notable uptick in quality of episodes after episode 5.
Previous to that I'd have rated season 2 below season 1, after it surpassed it.
Trek generally does not have a good or consistent record with themes of faith. There is a notable uptick in quality of episodes after episode 5.
Previous to that I'd have rated season 2 below season 1, after it surpassed it.
I think that's right. Pike would have represented "the old guard", especially since he was the first Starfleet captain ever filmed. I imagine he would have been an antagonist like President Rillak wound up being, not a bad person but someone who disagreed with Burnham. I imagine the original climax would have been Burnham advocating for some sort of highly dangerous science experiment to determine the true identity of the Red Angel, while Pike advocates against it since it's dangerous, and we should be okay with the idea some things are unknowable. Then Burnham shows her character development from last season by not mutinying, or something.
I think DS9 was able to find the right balance. I'm reminded of what Kira said about Faith. If your faith is strong enough, you don't have to explain it. You just feel it.
One day there'll be a tell-all about Discovery and it's the behind-the-scenes drama is gonna make the TNG early seasons look tame.
Personally, I never felt Disco S2 changed direction obviously, it didn't make much sense but that's time travel stories for you. A lot of shit was said online, but certain people were making up utter bollocks at the time so I don't give them much credence. I once read someone say Pike originally fell to his knees and wept before the angel in deleted scenes, but he also said JJ Abrams was involved in secret Hollywood trials after embezzling a fortune from Into Darkness, which "really" cost $66 million to make and not $190 million. And say what you like about Into Darkness, it looked amazing and all that money was clearly on screen.
Personally, I never felt Disco S2 changed direction obviously, it didn't make much sense but that's time travel stories for you. A lot of shit was said online, but certain people were making up utter bollocks at the time so I don't give them much credence. I once read someone say Pike originally fell to his knees and wept before the angel in deleted scenes, but he also said JJ Abrams was involved in secret Hollywood trials after embezzling a fortune from Into Darkness, which "really" cost $66 million to make and not $190 million. And say what you like about Into Darkness, it looked amazing and all that money was clearly on screen.
I love the twisted view of the world online Trek fans have.
Having recently finished re-watching DSC Season 2, after not having re-watched any of that season since 2020... my opinion of it went slightly down, and I do notice that they papered over some cracks, but I still thought it was a good season. Not my favorite season, but a good season. It's the most diverse season. You get carry-over from Discovery Season 1, you get set-up for what Discovery would become later, you get a taste of proto-SNW, and you get a taste of S31.
It's also the season that shifted Discovery's mentality the most. In Season 1 it felt like Anyone Can Die. In Season 2, it no longer felt like that. This is our crew, they're coming closer together (which actually really started a little bit earlier when they finally stood up to Lorca after he showed his true colors), and that will become even more important in Season 3, when they're all they've got because they're outsiders and their crewmates are the only other people they know from their time.
It's also the season that shifted Discovery's mentality the most. In Season 1 it felt like Anyone Can Die. In Season 2, it no longer felt like that. This is our crew, they're coming closer together (which actually really started a little bit earlier when they finally stood up to Lorca after he showed his true colors), and that will become even more important in Season 3, when they're all they've got because they're outsiders and their crewmates are the only other people they know from their time.
Explains a lot as s2 part 1 is my favourite Disco story and the second pat is shockingly bad.
That could easily have been their idea of building hype for the second half all along though. Ever since Cumberbatch wasn't Khan I haven't trusted Kurtzman to tell the truth about anything.
I think that's more on Abrams.
Hollywood generally doesn't.
The whole thing with Spider-Man No Way Home irritated me to no end. It's just the nature of the world, this whole idea that, "Oh, if we keep it a secret it will drive up interest."
Nah, if I'm interested I'll see it. If not, all the hype in the world won't get me there.
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