To pick a nit, Saavik was a lieutenant in TWOK. She was just back at the academy going through the Command School.
Poll The troubles with Saavik
- Thread starter Unnamed Caitian
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To pick a nit, Saavik was a lieutenant in TWOK. She was just back at the academy going through the Command School.
Only because he lied.
He assumed a problem.
It works still. She also did something new with her hair.
Humidity
Not if Saavik had come clean about being half-Romulan when she applied to the Academy. Assuming she was indeed honest about it, there would have been no complications.
Tarses wasn't in trouble because he was part Romulan, it was because he LIED about it.
Right... in one of the non-canon stories, he got a six month suspension for fudging his application, but was allowed to return to service after that.
What possible reason (in the story) would he be allowed back into Starfleet?
Forgiveness
Why not simply replace him with another who didn't lie to your face?
It's not the Starfleet way. See "The Menagerie" and a few other Starfleet officer does a bad thing episodes.
Indeed.
How many officers have lied and been allowed back in? How about Riker with Pressman? "I was just following orders." Which is not an excuse that stands up in any court. No? How about "The Enterprise Incident" and Kirk and Spock engage in espionage and don't tell the crew? No, bad example. Ok, "The First Duty." Tom Paris.
But, context matters, someone might argue. Yes, so Tarses context was taken in to account. He lied about his parentage and then owned up to it. So he was given another chance, in that book anyway.
This is a disconcerting question. On one hand, of course superior intelligence is a desirable trait. OTOH, Wesley was always presented as a stereotypical late-80s movie/tv nerd and the character was justly reviled.
Maybe Star Trek writers and producers are Humanities professionals, not STEMs, so in-universe everyone who can do Math are nerds (also LaForge cannot romance a woman. The other TNG main character that knows Math is a literal robot). in favour of Troi the shrink and other soft skills
Ugh...such a black mark on the supposed diverse future.
"Except Wesley. He deserves scorn."
I guess I look at it from the HR point of view...if someone genuinely messed up, the goal is to figure out what happened, learn from it, and move onwards as needed. It's not very productive to punish people just for the sake of being heavy-handed when it's possible to get back to all the good reasons why they were hired in the first place. Kind of like how in criminal justice, incarceration is usually a last resort despite it often being the only punishment suitable for, well, nearly every sort of crime as far as the court of public opinion goes. Or you probably wouldn't divorce your spouse for leaving socks on the floor, but you might if they blew the entire retirement fund in Vegas. Seeing as Tarses had a (evidently legitimate) suspicion that he'd be treated poorly in selection and advancement due to something as immutable as his genetic background, I'd say he learned his lesson about fibbing on forms and can be a good Starfleet officer in the end. After all, they let Worf keep commanding starships even after the incident with the Klingon freighter in Rules of Engagement...Sisko basically said it was sheer luck that the ship was a decoy or else things would have ended very differently for Worf. Definitely didn't let him off the hook though.
All of which is to say, I'm Team Romulan. Vulcan stoicism and logic but from the wrong side of the tracks on Hellguard.
I mean, I'm all for corrective action, coaching and learning from the word go. The management style I have is that there are usually three steps before there is a full on error being done deliberately-first mistake is on the manager/leader: they were not clear in their expectations, or somehow there was a miscommunication. The second time is a shared error. I'm not speaking clearly and you're not hearing. Third is when it's all on the person, either deliberately, or the job is beyond their skill.
For Tarses, he got caught up in a witch hunt and had lied about it, which he had to take responsibility for. Which, I think is something completely changeable since, one, his assumption was there would be a bias due to his parentage, and two, because he was outed in a witch hunt for spies.
I don't see any reason to end his career. But, then, I would need more than the episode provided.
It would also, I think, depend on how Tarses ended up with a Romulan ancestor in the first place. If, for example, his grandmother was taken prisoner by Romulans and assaulted (like Tasha Yar was), i'd think Starfleet would go easy on him. Who would want a thing like that to become public?
Having incredulously read the last several posts in this thread involving the minor character Simon Tarses, I spent some time at Memory Alpha and with a spreadsheet and now I come with a theory:
Spock (0.5 Human +0.5 Vulcan) and Saavik (0.5 Vulcan + 0.5 Romulan)'s kid (SSK for short) would have to be 0.25 Human +0.5 Vulcan +0.25 Romulan and his or her conception at Genesis happened in 2285, so he or she more probably was born in 2286.
PonFarr occurs every 7 years of a Vulcan's adult life, and Spock (born 2230) had his first at stardate 3372.7 (2267) at the age of 37.
So if SSK (b. 2286) had his first PF at 37 too (2323), his second would have to be at 44 y.o. in 2330 and the third at 51 y.o. in 2237.
(maybe 2238, because PF period isn't precisely 7.0 Earth years. Or because technobabble)
If SSK paired with a Human, their offspring would be
0.625Human+0.25Vulcan+0.125Romulan=0.625Human+0.375Vulcanoid (very close to 3/4)
Simon Tarses was 28 years old (the actor's age) and on the E-D in 2367 (the episode in which he appears) and thus born in 2339.
I think it's clear.
Simon Tarses is Spock's grandson.
Spock (0.5 Human +0.5 Vulcan) and Saavik (0.5 Vulcan + 0.5 Romulan)'s kid (SSK for short) would have to be 0.25 Human +0.5 Vulcan +0.25 Romulan and his or her conception at Genesis happened in 2285, so he or she more probably was born in 2286.
PonFarr occurs every 7 years of a Vulcan's adult life, and Spock (born 2230) had his first at stardate 3372.7 (2267) at the age of 37.
So if SSK (b. 2286) had his first PF at 37 too (2323), his second would have to be at 44 y.o. in 2330 and the third at 51 y.o. in 2237.
(maybe 2238, because PF period isn't precisely 7.0 Earth years. Or because technobabble)
If SSK paired with a Human, their offspring would be
0.625Human+0.25Vulcan+0.125Romulan=0.625Human+0.375Vulcanoid (very close to 3/4)
Simon Tarses was 28 years old (the actor's age) and on the E-D in 2367 (the episode in which he appears) and thus born in 2339.
I think it's clear.
Simon Tarses is Spock's grandson.
I was told there wasn't going to be any math.
As far as I'm concerned:
She's full Vulcan, since the Romulan aspect was never stated on screen.
She looks like Kirstie Alley in one movie and Robin Curtis in two others.
Never got pregnant, never had sex with Spock. The kid was just hitting puberty, he was done before they had a chance (they are fully clothed when we next see them and she doesn't have a single hair out of place). Besides, for all we know, after the handrubbing, they had a fight with sticks.
She's full Vulcan, since the Romulan aspect was never stated on screen.
She looks like Kirstie Alley in one movie and Robin Curtis in two others.
Never got pregnant, never had sex with Spock. The kid was just hitting puberty, he was done before they had a chance (they are fully clothed when we next see them and she doesn't have a single hair out of place). Besides, for all we know, after the handrubbing, they had a fight with sticks.
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