Discovery/Kelvin Crossover

[thribs]

That’s the main debate about Discovery. Should they go with the continuity of the Star Trek that came before; starting from real history up to 1966 onwards, or should they take everything that that has happened in the real world since 1966 and adapt that into the show. They seem to be leading toward the latter for Discovery which I don’t think is the right aporoach. All you’re doing with that is “muddying the waters” continuity wise with the show; making it not fit properly with the others.

 

[fireproof78]

That’s the main debate about Discovery. Should they go with the continuity of the Star Trek that came before; starting from real history up to 1966 onwards, or should they take everything that that has happened in the real world since 1966 and adapt that into the show. They seem to be leading toward the latter for Discovery which I don’t think is the right aporoach. All you’re doing with that is “muddying the waters” continuity wise with the show; making it not fit properly with the others.

Then just treat it as its own thing. Which, is more enjoyable for most shows any way, even with Star Trek. For instance, I don't have to watch TNG to enjoy VOY or DS9.

 

[thribs]

I tried to but beside all that, I didn’t think it was that great of a show. The story was very poorly done and besides Lorca, all the characters were very unlikeable.

 

[johnnybear]

Sure they can.

Well to you maybe but not me!
JB

 

[fireproof78]

Fair enough.

I tried to but beside all that, I didn’t think it was that great of a show. The story was very poorly done and besides Lorca, all the characters were very unlikeable.

I think this is more of the struggle with any show. If the characters are not enjoyable then it makes it easier to find fault with more stuff. Less positive, more negative feelings, and so on. So, while I don't agree, I do get that.

 

[Nyotarules]

Well yes. If you pay attention to the story, but don't pay attention to what is said off-screen.

Both the Abrams-universe and the DIS-universe are more technologically advanced than the TOS-universe.

They are more socially and culturally advanced as well, just close your ears and pretend TOS Pike, Kirk et al never made those 1960's comments about women and girls.

 

[Nyotarules]

That’s the main debate about Discovery. Should they go with the continuity of the Star Trek that came before; starting from real history up to 1966 onwards, or should they take everything that that has happened in the real world since 1966 and adapt that into the show. They seem to be leading toward the latter for Discovery which I don’t think is the right aporoach. All you’re doing with that is “muddying the waters” continuity wise with the show; making it not fit properly with the others.

The producers did the same with the movies STTMP and again in STWOK. Its unrealistic to expect a show produced in the 1960's to still carry 1960's production and cultural values 50 years later in TV land.
Did fans have an apolitical fit when the show had a female captain in the movies and alien personnel in Starfleet, even though you only saw one alien Starfleet officer in TOS and no female captains at all?
As GR allegedly said about the change to the Klingons in the movies compared to the TV, 'they always looked like that.' (ENT should left well enough alone on that topic.)

 

[johnnybear]

I think that was one thing that ENT did do well! The Klingons didn't look like bald boneheads and then later turtleheads until TMP and then TNG! In TOS they were an Asiatic mongol type group of aliens with droopy moustaches and goatees unless we're talking about the soldiers on Organia!
JB

 

[Syd Shanshala]

all the characters were very unlikeable.

Speak for yourself.
Stamets, Saru, and Tilly are amazing Star Trek characters, IMO.

 

[fireproof78]

The producers did the same with the movies STTMP and again in STWOK. Its unrealistic to expect a show produced in the 1960's to still carry 1960's production and cultural values 50 years later in TV land.
Did fans have an apolitical fit when the show had a female captain in the movies and alien personnel in Starfleet, even though you only saw one alien Starfleet officer in TOS and no female captains at all?
As GR allegedly said about the change to the Klingons in the movies compared to the TV, 'they always looked like that.' (ENT should left well enough alone on that topic.)

Agreed. It required no explanation and only complicated matters.

 

[Gary8]

I feel the show is set in the same universe.

 

[Kirk Prime]

Agreed. It required no explanation and only complicated matters.

In fairness, that was Ron Moore's fault. For the sake of one joke, he created a massive canon problem with the Klingons--which was basically unsolvable, but Enterprise made an attempt.

For what it's worth, they could have made a joke without making a joke.

Worf could have been used to explain once and for all. When he was on the space station with other Klingons, he would have had no ridges. When he was on the Defiant--ridges.

No explanation. No one notices.

Do it once. Have a lesser role for Worf. Funniest joke ever, that in canon, adopts Roddenberry's explanation that yes, they always looked like that.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Supppsedly they're in different universes so they can't cross over

The Kelvin was constructed prior to the divergence in timelines, so it exists in both. (And no, I'm not buying the theory that Nero's interference caused changes to the past as well as the future. That doesn't make any logical sense.)

And I'm not aware of any legal problems that would prevent the Kelvin or Captain Robau being mentioned in DSC. There was this thing that elements from the Kelvin films couldn't be used in novels, but that no longer applies.

Besides, Faran Tahir wants to play Robau again - he said he'd gladly return if DSC asked. So that alone is reason to hope.

 

[fireproof78]

That doesn't make any logical sense.

We're talking about time travel here.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Starfleet officers from the Prime Timeline made all sorts of trips to the past. If the timeline divergence "undid" those circumstances, then it very well could have affected past history. Assuming one gives a shit.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Starfleet officers from the Prime Timeline made all sorts of trips to the past. If the timeline divergence "undid" those circumstances, then it very well could have affected past history.

The divergence would not undo any of those trips.

Both prime and Kelvin timelines are possible futures. Nothing is overwritten. Any time travel that comes from after the divergence, still happens. In fact, characters from both timelines could travel back to before the divergence and meet each other...

 

[johnnybear]

I think JJs Trek was already slightly different to the original timeline even before the Nero incursion happened!
JB