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Data and other androids

Methuselah Flint

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
Just curious - Data is considered unique, and yet in TOS we see many androids, all even human-looking; indeed suggesting that Soong was not the first to make a break in this technology. Has any attempt ever been made to tie these two thoughts together? Especially as Roddenberry presumably meant for TNG to be in the same universe as TOS.

(I've read Immortal Coil which bridges both TOS and TNG androids, but it doesn't really account for the Data being 'alone [as an android] in the universe')
 
Are we ever expected to accept any of TOS' androids as being entirely sentient? It's not the android tech that makes Data unique. It's the AI that so perfectly achieved humanoid cognizance that did it. At least that's how I always took it
 
It's just one of those retcon type things. Forget what you know! This is the story now. Those previous ones don't count .

Odo was the only known shapeshifter in DS9 when Kirk and Picard encountered several of them previously.:shrug:
 
All valid points.

I guess like people say, Data is the first AI android with complete self-awareness, sentience etc (although he oddly lacks human skin colouring compared to earlier TOS androids).

Again, Odo is a non-solid Shapeshifter. I'm assuming earlier ones were 'solids', whereas Odo is completely different to any other.
 
I thought Data was unique because his brain used phased positrons, allowing information to pass both ways across his circuitry at the same time? So other robots / androids exploded when faced with contradiction, but Data just explodes if his phase discriminator fails.
 
Data was explicitly said to be unique in the sense that he was the only one in existence. That is, as of the 2370s, there was but a single sentient android (or artificial ife form) in the entire Federation, and Data was it, according to Torres in VOY "Prototype".

This is different from Odo being a unique type of shapeshifter, in a universe teeming with shapeshifters of all sorts. It is also different from Odo or Data being the first of his sort - something never stated or suggested, except within very narrow additional parameters. Data was "the second fully functional Soong-type positronic android known to have been constructed", to type it out in full.

This in itself prompts certain speculation. If Data is unique, but not the first, then it appears likely that there simply is zero demand for his sort. Or possibly low odds of survival, considering he wasn't always unique, and others like him have either perished or gone into deep hiding.

Before Data and his ilk, the UFP had met at least Ruk, a fully sapient Data-analogue, and Norman, a two-eyed king to an admittedly blind android community. The underlying technologies were open to UFP study afterwards, not destroyed in a cataclysmic explosion or anything. But Soong's colleague and competitor Graves ridicules the concept of playing with android puppets, and a court is swayed by a straw man argument about tin man soldiers or slaves; clearly, mechanical men aren't a good thing a priori.

That Soong nevertheless built sapient androids might be because those were an exceptionally good marketing gimmick for his true achievement, the positronic computer. Classic optronics might outdo positronics in all other applications, but perhaps a compact AI brain inside a humanlike braincase would work best if positronic? Even then, Soong never dared make a public demonstration, fearing ridicule - but something good came out of it, as Dr Bashir later is able to use positronics in brain prosthetics, a feat perhaps less facilitated if Soong had chosen to work on positronic starships.

In general, lone inventors working on supertechnologies of dubious practical worth don't IMHO create an inconsistent and splintered fictional universe. Rather, they are a Trek thing - and these mad scientists failing to share findings or goals even with close colleagues is another feature, perfectly allowing for "unique" accomplishments even when there exists precedent of sorts.

Timo Saloniemi
 
It's just one of those retcon type things. Forget what you know! This is the story now. Those previous ones don't count .

Odo was the only known shapeshifter in DS9 when Kirk and Picard encountered several of them previously.:shrug:

I never got the impression they thought Odo was the only shapeshifter in Trek. I got the impression they knew he was clearly not one of the shapeshifting species known to the Federation prior to the discovery of the wormhole.
 
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I never got the impression they thought Odo was the only shapeshifter in Trek. I got the impression they knew he was clearly not one of the shapeshifting species known to the Federation prior to the discovery of the wormhole.
It annoyed me every time he whinged about being the only one and nobody asked if he'd met any of the other shape shifting species. Surely he could have found some common ground and made a meeting worthwhile.
 
^No. They would still not be his people or tell him nothing about who he is, why he was in the place where he was discovered, and all that. I don't think Odo was whiny. It came up once in a while, prior to the first time we see the founders....
 
Are there any actual genuine shapeshifting species besides Odo? I don't think the salt vampire counts, and Captain Garth was... taught how to shapeshift? They might just be illusionists of some sort.
 
Are you joking? The alien Kirk befriended at Rura Penthe...where s/he told them their species' name and Kirk and McCoy recognized it as a race of shapeshifters.

....and the alien Wesley fell in love with....
 
If they can't turn into an eagle that can fly, a purse, a backpack, or a pair of handcuffs, they are not a true shapeshifter.
 
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It's just one of those retcon type things. Forget what you know! This is the story now. Those previous ones don't count .

Odo was the only known shapeshifter in DS9 when Kirk and Picard encountered several of them previously.:shrug:

Kirk I don't know anything about.
But I don't recall Picard and a shape shifter.
Also, even if Picard encountered a shape shifter, would it have not been possible that the shapeshifter Picard encountered was a completly different species than Odo.
So like Picard's shapeshifters are now referred to as Transient Beings, from Zapltyyia? Or just as Zapplyites.
 
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