Garrett Wang

[DonIago]

It doesn't matter. At some point before this happened, they were all the same person. The Harry who got sucked out the airlock to his death WAS the Harry who did that cool rolling phaser shot on that Vidiian. So regardless of who was the original and who was the duplicate (if the question can be answered at all), both were quite real. Ergo, the Harry who continued with Voyager was eminently promotable.

My only point was that calling one V the original and the other a duplicate, without stronger evidence than I've seen thus far, doesn't really seem accurate, as both have equal claim to being the "original".

So yes, since they're both the same Kim despite a few hours(?) of different memories, I don't see why that would have any impact on promotability, though I'm guessing this entire rationale may be a bit facetious in any case.

 

[Oddish]

So yes, since they're both the same Kim despite a few hours(?) of different memories, I don't see why that would have any impact on promotability, though I'm guessing this entire rationale may be a bit facetious in any case.

1. There is no logical rationale for Harry's lack of advancement.
2. When there's no logical rationale for something, people often feel the need to settle for ridiculous rationales instead.
3. And there you go.

 

[gweeps]

Wasn't it the other way around?

No.

Besides, it's much cooler to think the majority of that episode is from the perspective of a duplicate Voyager crew.

 

[gweeps]

Why does starting the proton bursts first make them the original? Couldn't that just be luck?

Maybe. But I think there must have been a lag time between copies realizing what had to be done. Makes logical sense to me.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Did she invent it? Or just want a lab to measure it?

It's possible that Voyager, having only 15 decks, couldn't have everything the flagship did, so it wasn't outfitted with an astrometrics lab. So, Harry and Seven just retrofitted one in.



Reminds me of a thought I had about a disturbing but funny end for "Favorite Son". Harry gets his DNA "harvested" by two women (instead of three), not quite enough to kill him. So, the Voyager crew Pulaski him with the transporter, using a stored pattern and restoring him to full health but causing him to forget everything. They send him back to Taresia, where two more women are waiting their turn. Rinse and repeat however many times, until Harry has (probably very painfully) fathered hundreds of offspring. Then, they Pulaski him back to full health and leave, making up some excuse with Harry that his genes weren't as compatible as they thought.

It's the word "astrometrics" the branding, more so than the imaginary technology involved.

 

[Farscape One]

If I remember correctly, in "REVULSION", Chakotay asks Kim to work with Seven to upgrade Astrometrics, not create Astrometrics. "SHATTERED" actually has the wrong dialogue with Janeway saying the ship doesn't have an Astrometrics.

 

[DonIago]

I always figured Astrometrics was kind of a souped-up Stellar Cartography.

 

[StarMan]

1. There is no logical rationale for Harry's lack of advancement.

I believe there is a perfectly reasonable explanation.

Kim attempted to dissuade Captain Janeway from murdering Tuvix in an off-screen confrontation in her Ready Room. In Kim's mind, he was showing initiative - whatever the Captain's decision, his forthrightness on the subject would win Janeway's respect. At least that was the theory.

But the plucky Harry Kim wholly miscalculated and instead earned a black mark from the vindictive Janeway.

Even now decades on, Kim is denied the most basic advancement in rank. Janeway - in an effort to amuse herself further - arranges a review of Kim's performance alongside several other officers many years his junior. While the 20-something ensigns all move on to Lt. JG, Kim can only look on in embarrassment as the freshly minted lieutenants receive their pips, with the sadistic Admiral unable to hold back a smirk as she glances in Harry's direction.

"Keep up the good work, Ensign."

Slight embellishment towards the end, but on the whole I think it works.

 

[Oddish]

Slight embellishment towards the end, but on the whole I think it works.

There's only one minor problem...

Spoiler

We're not in the Mirror Universe.

 

[Guy Gardener]

There's only one minor problem...

Spoiler

We're not in the Mirror Universe.

Kes might have split the timeline in Fury.

 

[Oddish]

Kes might have split the timeline in "Fury".

Well, if we're talking alternate timelines...
Harry was a captain in Endgame.
He was a full lieutenant in Before and After.
His rank in "Timeless" is unknown, but it's a safe bet he got promoted there, too.
And he was as good as promoted (after 8 months) before the temporal monkeyshines of "Non Sequitur".
So... does anyone have an argument that actually holds water?

 

[Guy Gardener]

Well, if we're talking alternate timelines...
Harry was a captain in Endgame.
He was a full lieutenant in Before and After.
His rank in "Timeless" is unknown, but it's a safe bet he got promoted there, too.
And he was as good as promoted (after 8 months) before the temporal monkeyshines of "Non Sequitur".
So... does anyone have an argument that actually holds water?

Fury was not reversed.

They changed every thing, and then carried on.

 

[Oddish]

Whatever changes "Fury" made to the timeline, it did not turn Kathryn Janeway into the twisted and sadistic hag that @StarMan was portraying her as.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Hag?

The older I get, the better a 40 year old Jane way looks.

The older I get the more Kes looks like jailbait.

The older I get, the more I want to cook Seven of Nine a Sunday Roast.'

The older I get, the more I want to muzzle B'Elanna.

 

[Oddish]

Hag?

The older I get, the better a 40 year old Jane way looks.

Oh, agreed. I was referring to her behavior in StarMan's little narrative, not her appearance. Maybe b**ch would have been a better word choice, but after 8 years on boards where bad language was restricted, old habits die hard.

The older I get the more Kes looks like jailbait.

The older I get, the more I want to cook Seven of Nine a Sunday Roast.'

As they were on VOY? I'd just buy them both a balloon. And that's literal, no doble entendre intended. Not saying my standards are high, but I think "at least 50 percent my own age" is a reasonable minimum.

Seven's not half-bad these days, though.

The older I get, the more I want to muzzle B'Elanna.

I would enjoy watching you try. And also rewatching the heavily edited carnage on next morning's "A Briefing With Neelix". Right before the EMH's very enlightening chat about the human lymphatic system.

 

[Guy Gardener]

If Cardassians are taught how time travel works poorly, Seska would have run down to the hold, and see if old Kes was still there, because the little corpse girl with the terrible hair cut is practically a temporal barometer.

1. Old Janeway can't Send old Kes to the past, if old Seska is in charge of Voyager.

2. Old Kes in her Crypt, is still going to vanish eventually after Seska has made sure that she keeps Voyager.

3. Old Kes, who is gone, will come back if it seems to time, that Seska is going to lose possession of the ship.

 

[Oddish]

It's a good thing time paradoxes don't actually obliterate the entire universe, or the entire fabric of Trek reality would have shredded a long time ago.

 

[gweeps]

Harry should've been promoted at the end of 'Timeless'.

 

[gweeps]

It's a good thing time paradoxes don't actually obliterate the entire universe, or the entire fabric of Trek reality would have shredded a long time ago.

This is what the Travelers/Temporal Investigations folks are for.

 

[Ragitsu]

I'm a Wildman/Gilmore kind of person, myself.