Yield of Torpedoes and Strenght of Shields.

[Timo]

The only things to come from the tech manual were the total yeild and the size of the warhead. The rest was simple math: take the total result in megatons of yeild for the size warhead stated (assume a 100% efficient reaction) and divide by the stated number of isotons.

Indeed. But the yield in isotons is not supported elsewhere, least of all in aired Trek. And while we can "objectively" decide that an annihilation mass of 1.5 kg (or 1.5 + 1.5 kg, the wording is a bit unclear) is perfectly reasonable even if it's not canonical, we can't similarly deduce our way through the mystery that is isoton.

But the idea that isoton~megaton is workable as regards canon, so the TNG TM figures need not be completely out of whack. It just appears curious that the torpedoes of Voyager would have such massively larger maximum yield in "Scorpion, pt II": 200 isotons!

Unless, of course, the yield in that episode was for the sum total of the 32 warheads mentioned, giving just 6 1/4 isotons per torpedo. Which might be perfectly reasonable, too: the Intrepid class might carry featherweight ("class 6"/"type 6") torpedoes as standard, as opposed to the much heavier ones of the Galaxy class.

Indeed, if the standard Voyager torps were of 6 isoton (that is, 10 megaton) range, it would be all the more natural for Kim to gape at the supertorp in "Omega Directive", with some 50, and later 80, isotons. Not quite a planetcracker like he quips, but still very impressive for Kim's standards - as opposed to a situation where the standard torp would already be 25 isotons.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Timo]

Oh, and one piece of speculation: if we literally read isoton as "the same as one ton of substance X", what should X be?

if the speculation from TNG Tech Man is to be taken literally, then substance X should have 2.6 million times the explosive power of TNT. We don't have a substance today that would react with such violence, but there is nothing to say that the scientists of Trek wouldn't have invented a substance that releases such energies in proper circumstances. Not out of chemical bonds, obviously, but perhaps from some sort of subatomic bonds?

The list of explosive substances at Memory Alpha is long enough. But the most interesting one there, and the one with the greatest destructive power, is ultritium. Ninety isotons of ultritium can vaporize almost everything within a 800 km blast radius in "A Time to Stand". Note the use of isoton as a seeming unit of mass here, a unique occurrence in explosives-related treknobabble; to justify this, we might well argue that ultritium indeed is the substance X of which ninety tons create a ninety-isoton explosion.

That's some scary stuff. A fistful explodes like a thousand tons of TNT! It's also by far the most commonly used high yield explosive in Star Trek, at least after antimatter. It would make good sense to have it as the standard on which isotons are based, now wouldn't it?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Deks]

Uhm ... Voyager's photon torpedoes were newest type (class 6 warheads).
If I'm not mistaken the Enterprise-D also carried type 6 photon torpedoes as well in later seasons.
Torpedoes could vary from ship to ship only in class, but all would be replaced with the latest type as soon as possible (especially prior or during the war with Dominion) as every starship is capable of carrying any type of photon torpedoes.

And as I previously mentioned in this thread the 200 isotons figure from Scorpion was probably the total sum of all 32 photon torpedoes put together and not a yield of 1 torpedo.

 

[Timo]

Uhm ... Voyager's photon torpedoes were newest type (class 6 warheads).

Indeed. And Class 6 might well be lighter than the older, clumsier Class 5.

If I'm not mistaken the Enterprise-D also carried type 6 photon torpedoes as well in later seasons.

They never told what type or class of torps the E-D carried. (Anyway, are "type" and "class" interchangeable here, or is it just a coincidence that the Voyager happens to carry Type 6 torpedoes, as per "Dreadnought", with Class 6 warheads, as per "Scorpion"?)

Torpedoes could vary from ship to ship only in class, but all would be replaced with the latest type as soon as possible (especially prior or during the war with Dominion) as every starship is capable of carrying any type of photon torpedoes.

We don't know this. It might well be that only the biggest starships are capable of taking aboard the advanced loading system that can securely fill a Class 5 warhead to capacity, and midget vessels like Voyager are limited to equipment that can only support Class 3 and Class 6 low-yield warheads.

We only know that most of the torpedoes and small probes we have seen have been of roughly the same size and shape. That doesn't necessarily mean compatibility with all launchers that have this bore, any more than one would expect all 7.62 mm rifle barrels to be able to take both the Soviet and Western versions of ammunition that has this caliber, or a .308 to be able to fire a .303 round.

Really, since we have never seen a photon launcher fire a quantum or vice versa, we are quite justified in speculating that the outward appearance of a torpedo doesn't tell the whole story of compatibility.

And as I previously mentioned in this thread the 200 isotons figure from Scorpion was probably the total sum of all 32 photon torpedoes put together and not a yield of 1 torpedo.

Indeed, sorry that I missed your mention and presented the idea as novel!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Deks]

lol ... calm down.

For all we know, a class 1 photon torpedo could be 10x powerful than class 5 torpedoes and we don't see them in use in the 24th century or ever mentioned.
Logically speaking, it stands to reason that newer classes of photon torpedoes are smarter/technologically better/delivering more damaging explosions in comparison to their earlier counterparts.
The only thing that would vary from ship to ship would be the quantity of the torpedoes each ship can carry.
Voyager is a smaller ship and therefore is able to carry a smaller compliment of torpedoes (and nothing on screen indicated the Type 6 torpedoes are lower yield than their counterparts).

Photon torpedo launchers are capable of firing any photon torpedo regardless of class.
Heck even Voyager could have modified their own photon launchers to fire the quantum torpedoes (as was mentioned on screen).
In the episode 'Dreadnought' it was mentioned by Janeway that Voyager has 'Type 6 photon torpedoes'.
In episode 'Scorpion', 7 mentioned the following and I quote:
'Photon torpedo compliment 32, class 6 warheads. Explosive yield 200 isotons.'

Based on those 2 episodes, I think the terms 'class' and 'type' and interchangeable.
Shuttles were also referred on numerous occasions as either 'type 9' or 'class 9'.

It's true it was not mentioned what type of photon torpedoes the Enterprise-D had (my mistake for writing the opposite), but from what we DO know, is that type 6 torpedoes were put into active service with Voyagers launch or quite possibly at a time just prior to it.
Janeway mentioned in 'Dreadnought' that the type 6 torpedoes Voyager has might just get through the weapons shields since her ship was not in service by the time Dreadnought was reprogrammed and was sent to the DQ (which directly indicates that Type 6 photon torpedoes were put into service with or just prior Voyagers launch and are probably better than the earlier versions).