Was Takei's reason silly for not appearing in Generations?

[Aldo]

I'll be the first to admit this could be nothing but a rumor, but over at the trivia section of IMDB is this gem for Generations:

The producers asked George Takei to come back and play Sulu one more time, and take the helm of the Enterprise-B. But Takei refused because if Sulu had taken the helm, it would have meant temporarily reducing Sulu's rank, so that he could serve under Captain Kirk again. He felt that Sulu had worked too hard to earn his command to allow even a temporary reduction.

We all know the scene in question and it would have probably been cute. Of course had Takei returned as Sulu we probably wouldn't have gotten his daughter in the movie. It just seems like a dumb reason to me...of course it makes sense after reading his autobiography and seeing how much of a stick up his ass he had when it came to Shatner.

 

[ColeMercury]

Seems a fair enough reason to me.

 

[F. King Daniel]

The whole point of Sulu as Excelsior captain in STVI was to show he'd moved on. Putting him on the E-B as helmsman "for old time's sake" (or whatever) would have been a step backwards.

If I were Takei, I'd want to exit Star Trek as captain of the USS Excelsior, flying off to new adventures at the end of STVI and not as token nostalgia helmsman in the opening segment of GENS where Kirk supposedly dies but he really doesn't for another 90 minutes.

 

[HoneyBLilly]

It was fair enough.

I just wish Uhura/Nichols had come back and done something. The most we got of her was in "Trials and Tribble-ations"

 

[Admiral_Young]

Yet we've seen Spock and Kirk share the same rank for three Trek films. Why would Sulu be demoted? I think it's silly.

 

[Guartho]

I can see CAPTAIN Sulu being on hand for the christening of what could be the second Excelsior class ship. Then Sulu jumping into the helm chair during the crisis might make sense. But then, having the current captain of an Excelsior on board would make him the most qualified to take charge of the situation.

 

[Admiral_Young]

Why would he leave the Excelsior though?

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Why would he leave the Excelsior though?

Botany conference?

 

[Aldo]

Why would he leave the Excelsior though?

Chekov and Scotty were there too, and at least Chekov wasn't retired at that point. There is nothing saying Sulu couldn't have been on hand for the Enterprise-B's maiden voyage and still held the rank of Captain. I mean at that point Scotty held the rank of Captain as well!

 

[HoneyBLilly]

Why would he leave the Excelsior though?

Botany conference?

Fencing competition?

 

[Nerys Myk]

Was he ever in the script? Originally it was Kirk, Spock and McCoy at the launch. Then Kirk, Scott and Chekov when Nimoy and Kelly declined. Did they go to Takei before offering Koenig a role?

 

[Cyke101]

Why would he leave the Excelsior though?

Chekov and Scotty were there too, and at least Chekov wasn't retired at that point. There is nothing saying Sulu couldn't have been on hand for the Enterprise-B's maiden voyage and still held the rank of Captain. I mean at that point Scotty held the rank of Captain as well!

But Chekov didn't take navigation. Also, he was more commanding and more proactive than he's usually portrayed, by taking charge of medical (even though he's not an MD) and recruiting reporters as nurses. So while Chekov was on hand to help, he was really thinking in terms of agency and immediacy, and not waiting around for orders from Kirk (I think, feel free to correct), as opposed to the good ol' days. He wasn't twiddling his thumbs and cracking some sidekick joke about Russia. In that sense, he too had grown.

As for Sulu, IIRC, the writers and Takei had been wanting to give Sulu his own ship for some time well before VI too, so his getting the Excelsior was a hard fought battle not just for Takei. But ultimately being in the scene as you describe it would have been Sulu receiving a temporary demotion for the sake of a glorified cameo (essentially the same reason why Nimoy and Kelley chose not to participate in the film).

On a personal level, it was really empowering to see Sulu as a heroic figure in TOS. It was *even more* empowering to see Sulu as a separate hero captain, too. In hindsight, seeing him back in the driver's seat, even if the script went out of its way to explain why the captain of the Excelsior was at the helm, would take me out of the film. Actually, Scotty's uncharacteristic technobabble took me out of the film

 

[Admiral_Young]

The first drat of the Generations script has the entire TOS crew present aboard the Enterprise-B. I've read subsequent drafts shrunk them down until it was meant to be Spock, Bones, and Kirk. Then ultimately changed to Scotty, Checkov, and Kirk.

 

[Cyke101]

The first drat of the Generations script has the entire TOS crew present aboard the Enterprise-B. I've read subsequent drafts shrunk them down until it was meant to be Spock, Bones, and Kirk. Then ultimately changed to Scotty, Checkov, and Kirk.

IIRC, the script was rewritten many times not just to conform to the studio's requests, but also to accommodate the production's strict time table, with filming starting almost immediately after All Good Things.., so there wasn't enough time to even really negotiate with Nimoy and Kelley. Had the production not been so rushed, I'm so sure the writers might have found a way to include the entire TOS crew in a way that would satisfy the cast.

 

[Admiral_Young]

Yep. I'm convinced this would have been a better film overall in terms of a "passing the torch" type of plot had it not been decided to rush it out right away.

 

[Gorn Captain]

If it were true it would be a silly reason, but it's not true. George Takei has never turned down a role in a feature film in his life, and neither would Nichelle or Walter.

De Kelley didn't decline, he just wasn't well enough to appear, and couldn't be insured. The only one who actually said "No" was Nimoy. And he said no to this movie not only as an actor but as director as well.

 

[Cyke101]

Well, I'm going by Memory Alpha, which states that Kelley outright declined, with no mention about his health. Likewise, I don't think any Trek writer would ever turn down the chance of having the entire TOS crew on a TNG-era production, if a proper way in-story and proper negotiations could be achieved, as well as an appropriate amount of prep-time.

 

[antiquityscion]

Actually, it worked with just Kirk, Scotty, and Chekov, because that is how real life usually works. Ceremonies where they can only assemble a partial crew, military unit, movie casts, or whatever. But it would have been nice if McCoy was there, too.

 

[HoneyBLilly]

Well, I'm going by Memory Alpha, which states that Kelley outright declined, with no mention about his health. Likewise, I don't think any Trek writer would ever turn down the chance of having the entire TOS crew on a TNG-era production, if a proper way in-story and proper negotiations could be achieved, as well as an appropriate amount of prep-time.

From IMDb, which is just as credible as memory-alpha if not moreso:

DeForest Kelley was set to appear in this movie as Dr. Leonard "Bones" McCoy, but due to his declining health, he could not get on-set insurance (a union requirement for anyone on a film set). His lines were then given to Walter Koenig as Chekov.

This is about Nimoy:

Leonard Nimoy was originally asked to act in and direct this film, but he declined after reading the script and being told there was not time to fix the parts with which he had problems. According to Nimoy, there was a character named Spock in the script, but the lines were so bland they could have been spoken by anyone (those lines were given to James Doohan as Scotty; Nimoy later pointed to this as proof he was right).

And then this is just added:

SPOILER: Originally, there was a scene in the script for Captain Kirk's funeral. In the scene Spock was to be standing at the entrance of the church, hesitant to enter (And therefore admitting to himself that his friend was REALLY dead). He was supposed to be overwhelmed and slightly revealing his emotional side as he was being urged into the service by Doctor McCoy (DeForest Kelley) and Scotty (James Doohan). But Leonard Nimoy ultimately passed on the film and Kelley was in declining health and couldn't get insured, so the scene was never filmed, but it does appear in the novelization

 

[CobraCommander]

I believe that had Takei been approached and had rejected an appearance, it was the right call. Takei had wanted his character to grow and evolve. In any military structure, an officer would not remain a Lieutenant for over 20 years, let alone under the same commanding officer. Chekov had been a first officer in STII but got demoted afterwards. Sulu had a great send off in STVI and didn't need a cameo to add to his character. In regards to Generations, I feel that it should not have been made. The producers and studio should have waited a couple of years and then come out with First Contact. I have always felt that the whole Nexus plot line was convoluted and the production qualities were a rushed mess (To be a movie or TV production... that is the question). Cobra

P.S... In the Generations timeline, Scotty should have been stuck in a transporter buffer. I guess that the Generations writers didn't know their TNG very well.