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Superman

"The comics" usually just the the most commonly accepted version of a character for the purposes of some useless argument. "Don't you read the comics?" (said derisively) is usually just to try and show why someone else's preference is somehow wrong. Like, I don't like a lot of the things Snyder did with the characters. (A LOT!) But I'm pretty sure* I've never compared it to the comics as though that somehow validates me.

*But if I have, I renounce that I said it. ;)
 
I don't care how much of a hippy Kal-El is across the Multi-Verse because there's still that one Universe where Ronald Reagan told Superman to pluck Oliver Queen's arm out of it's socket, and he said "Yes Mr. President sir, how many limbs do I pull out of him, sir?"
 
That cover is an old favorite, whoever drew her expression and hunched over that steering wheel is great.
That would be Kurt Schaffenberger, who drew a ton of Superman's Girl Friend Lois Lane covers and interiors. He was indeed great, with a very polished style that had just enough cartooniness to capture the humor of the stories without going over the top.
 
"The comics" usually just the the most commonly accepted version of a character for the purposes of some useless argument. "Don't you read the comics?" (said derisively) is usually just to try and show why someone else's preference is somehow wrong. Like, I don't like a lot of the things Snyder did with the characters. (A LOT!) But I'm pretty sure* I've never compared it to the comics as though that somehow validates me.

*But if I have, I renounce that I said it. ;)
Considering that comics are read by a very small minority of the population, it is interesting to see where the perception of the figure of Superheroes comes from. For example, If before Raimi's film I had done a survey on what work Peter Parker does in everyday life, most probably would have answered "photographer" just because they remembered him from the 60s cartoon.
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Same with Superman: I'm pretty sure the public perception of him was mostly shaped by Super-Friends cartoons and movies. I don't think print media was even a factor.
 
But does it matter?
Group psychosis.

We can't have a group psychosis if there's no core belief.

Even though I never watched the 1952 live action show, as a child, this is Superman to me...

Faster than a speeding bullet! More powerful than a locomotive! Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound! Yes, it's Superman, strange visitor from another planet, who came to Earth with powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men. Superman, who can change the course of mighty rivers, bend steel in his bare hands, and who, disguised as Clark Kent, mild-mannered reporter for a great metropolitan newspaper, fights a never-ending battle for truth, justice and the American way.

Because almost every other version of Superman since has parroted these sentiments.
 
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It's absolutely true that popular perceptions of superheroes are shaped more by movie and TV adaptations than by the comics. The adaptations are seen by many, many more people than ever read the source material.

In Superman's case, I think Superman '78 remains the defining portrayal of the character in the public consciousness, and likely always will. Which is a good thing IMO, because it's a classic and as perfect a version of Superman as one could reasonably ask for. Every portrayal of the character since (even in the comics) either bears the film's influence or is reacting against it -- the latter of which only confirms its continuing importance even after 40+ years.
 
I just started watching DC Supergirl and in that she saves a falling plane. I just wanted to contrast that fiction with the show The Boys.

Here's the thing I read on a board that in the show The Boys their flying guy Homelander can't do stuff like that because he'd tear through the plane and not be able to hold it up so is there a plot reason in each universe why Superman / Supergirl can save falling aircraft and in the other show they can't do that?
 
I just started watching DC Supergirl and in that she saves a falling plane. I just wanted to contrast that fiction with the show The Boys.

Here's the thing I read on a board that in the show The Boys their flying guy Homelander can't do stuff like that because he'd tear through the plane and not be able to hold it up so is there a plot reason in each universe why Superman / Supergirl can save falling aircraft and in the other show they can't do that?
For a while post-Crisis, DC tried to create pseudo-scientific explanations and rules for Superman's powers that go further than "yellow sun". I remember John Byrne over time build an arc around Superman trying to understand how his powers work, noticing, for instance, that he can lift more weight when he flies than when he's on the ground. When they turned Professor Hamilton into a semi-regular character, they really went big on this, using the character to do tests with Superman, and coming up with theories. Eventually, there even was a book published on The Science of Superman, collecting all these theories and adding to them.

If I remember correctly, in the case of saving a falling plane, the idea was that Earth's atmosphere caused a mutation in one of Superman's organs, making him able to control gravitons in himself and, to a lesser degree, objects/people he has direct physical contact with. So, the instance he touches the plane, he makes it lighter. And this ability is amplified when he is simultaneously controling the gravitons of his own body, which is why he appears stronger while flying.

Of course, over time, DC has become rather lax about making sure writers follow all these rules.
 
I just started watching DC Supergirl and in that she saves a falling plane. I just wanted to contrast that fiction with the show The Boys.

Here's the thing I read on a board that in the show The Boys their flying guy Homelander can't do stuff like that because he'd tear through the plane and not be able to hold it up so is there a plot reason in each universe why Superman / Supergirl can save falling aircraft and in the other show they can't do that?
I honestly think sweating real-world physics in a Superman story is a textbook example of overthinking things. That said, I might suggest you give Superman Returns a watch, if you've never seen it. In that movie, Superman struggles to stop a plummeting plane (with Lois aboard), as it basically tears itself apart in his hands. It's a thrilling sequence, brilliantly executed, and certainly one of the better action setpieces in any Superman movie, as even those who dislike the film tend to acknowledge.
 
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I honestly think sweating real-world physics in a Superman story is a textbook example of overthinking things. That said, I might suggest you give Superman Returns a watch, if you've never seen it. In that movie, Superman struggles to stop a plummeting plane (with Lois aboard), as it basically tears itself apart in his hands. It's a thrilling sequence, brilliantly executed, and certainly one of the better action setpieces in any Superman movie, as even those who dislike the film tend to acknowledge.

And then he lifts a continent of Kryptonite into orbit.

Totally grounded.
 
I mean,

Golden Age Superman



Silver Age Superman



Bronze Age Superman

superman_269_09b.JPG


Post-Crisis Superman.



Find the inspirational one.

Fear not, mate. The Dickery is still in him.

Clark an his coworker Steve Lombard.
All Star Superman (2006)
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Post-Crisis
Clark and Steve Lombard "Superman Brainiac" 2008.

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Superman stops a school shooting and threatens the gun store owner who sold the boys the guns.
Superman Birthright (2003).

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New 52 Superman #15 (2012)
Superman (T-Shirt and jeans) brings Connor (who is wearing Clark's armor after nearly dying and needs it to recover) to a prison tailor made to prevent Luthor from escaping and any humans from entering unauthorized. Connor's genetic donors are Clark and Lex.

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The torch has been passed to Clark and Lois' son, Jon.

DC Rebirth
Supersons Annual #1 (2016)
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I just started watching DC Supergirl and in that she saves a falling plane. I just wanted to contrast that fiction with the show The Boys.

Here's the thing I read on a board that in the show The Boys their flying guy Homelander can't do stuff like that because he'd tear through the plane and not be able to hold it up so is there a plot reason in each universe why Superman / Supergirl can save falling aircraft and in the other show they can't do that?

For a while post-Crisis, DC tried to create pseudo-scientific explanations and rules for Superman's powers that go further than "yellow sun". I remember John Byrne over time build an arc around Superman trying to understand how his powers work, noticing, for instance, that he can lift more weight when he flies than when he's on the ground. When they turned Professor Hamilton into a semi-regular character, they really went big on this, using the character to do tests with Superman, and coming up with theories. Eventually, there even was a book published on The Science of Superman, collecting all these theories and adding to them.

If I remember correctly, in the case of saving a falling plane, the idea was that Earth's atmosphere caused a mutation in one of Superman's organs, making him able to control gravitons in himself and, to a lesser degree, objects/people he has direct physical contact with. So, the instance he touches the plane, he makes it lighter. And this ability is amplified when he is simultaneously controling the gravitons of his own body, which is why he appears stronger while flying.

Of course, over time, DC has become rather lax about making sure writers follow all these rules.

@Kai "the spy" and myself made similar posts regarding Superman's powers on page 32 of this thread. I'll repost my summation here.

I posted about this several years ago in a Supergirl thread. Kryptonian super feats are split between John Carter of Mars/Earth's weaker gravity and telekinesis.

Byrne used the telekinetic explanation for Gladiator during his FF run and used the same explanation during his Superman run. This telekinetic control is what keeps Superman and other Kryptonian's from tearing things apart with their Herculean strength. It's all tactile (touch) telekinesis. So, unlike say a Jean Grey. Who can move things with her mind. Superman and other Kryptonians have to be physically touching what they want to move. Pay attention to Reed's deductions and explanations of Gladiator's powers. Gladiator (real name Kallark/Kal and Clark) being one of Marvel's many Superman clones.

DC's main explanation really boils down to "because he's Superman". They don't feel it needs an explanation.
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Recall also in the Superman 1978, Jor-El said that Superman will defy gravity on Earth. Telekinetic levitation would be a way to negate the force of gravity. Zack Snyder incorporated the telekinetic explanation in his films. Notice how before Superman and Zod fly, objects around them levitate for a moment.
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How Superman deals with falling airplanes. Notice the pattern? *wink wink*

1986 The Man of Steel #1 - John Byrne
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1996 Superman the Animated Series - Bruce Timm
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2006 Superman Returns - Bryan Singer
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2016 Supergirl Season 2 - CW
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2019 The Boys - Amazon
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"Superman-as-Santa"

What you write with derision, I embrace. Superman, during the most successful years of his publication

Superman became increasingly irrelevant to many DC readers as the Silver Age wore on, hence the very reason the editors sought to remove Santa stench from the character toward the end of the 1960s. Readers (and comic creators) were no longer enamored of a character that was so childish and far removed from what was happening in other titles which were supposed to be in the same universe.
The contrast between Super-Santa and most of the other mid-late 1960s DC titles could not be more glaring: it was not just the Batman titles that were undergoing a major (and welcome) change at the end of the 60s (in the hands of Robbins and Novick), but once light fare such as the original Teen Titans book dropped the "groovy sidekicks" trapping of its earlier years and embraced topics ranging from student protest, the murder of a public figure (and the pitfalls of adopting pacifism as a result of said murder), implied genocide, etc, while resident misfits--The Doom Patrol--ended their 1st run with an act far more becoming of a superhero and noble than any of the lollipops and ice cream-dishing Super-Santa antics from Superman during the height of the Weisinger reign.

Add the introduction of the Deadman and the resurgence of The Spectre and there was no denying the fact many creators--out of their own evolving creative tastes--changed books to meet readers' equally evolving, maturing interests, which were not met by the 160,000 times Lois attempted to marry Superman, the 90,000 times he had to save the eternally naive Jimmy Olsen from himself, facing off with some circus strongman equivalent, or was flummoxed by yet another Mxyzptlk prank, etc.

With the dawn of a new decade, that version of Superman could not convince any reader that it occupied the same world where the O'Neil / Adams Green Lantern/Green Arrow,'s stories, the Ra's al Ghul / League of Assassins sagas, tragedy of Man-Bat, the revival of the sinister Joker, The Shadow, the continued Spectre stories, and a wealth of similarly mature stories existed. For that reason, the 1970s comic book Superman was slowly, but surely changing to meet reader expectations, with the character finally feeling like a believable part of his DC universe as it existed by the time DC celebrated its 50th anniversary in 1985.

Since that period, every change to Superman has not always been a winner, but even in their failings, they presented a character that was more a functional, believable part of the universe DC developed than the once-bloated, finger wagging Weisinger Super-Santa who was as aligned with the the other titles as Popeye would have been in EC's Shock SuspenStories.

Thankfully, there's at least one modern, live-action interpretation (which is not Superman and Lois) that recognizes the creatively bankrupt Weisinger period and influence are what nearly destroyed the character over a half-century ago, and being a silly anachronism is not what anyone has a desire to see return.
 
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What you are describing is a shift from Superman primarily existing in his own expansive universe, and being primarily written for children of all ages, to being compressed to serve a larger DC universe and being written for an increasingly adult audience---and from being a more mythic figure to being simply one of many super heroes. In other words, the Marvelization of Superman. As to whether or not this was an improvement, ymmv.
 
What you are describing is a shift [...] from being a more mythic figure
No. There's nothing remotely mythic about the behavior of Superman cited by @Skipper, when he abusively punishes innocent Jimmy and Supergirl.

You mean the one who abandoned his traumatized and just orphaned cousin in an orphanage because he could not be bothered and then he exiled her because she committed the orribile sin of playing with his dog, because, you know, she was just a kid and she wanted just to have fun? ;)



Silver Age Superman

Frank Miller deconstructs this conception of Silver Age Superman fairly well in The Dark Knight Returns, when his Superman agrees to use his powers to uphold lawful authority, even to become a weapon of war.

I would characterize the Silver Age conception of Superman as "law and order Superman." This conception shows Superman possessing an American value that emerged during the Cold War, under which right and wrong are reduced to two diametric opposites without any degrees or shades of gray in between, and the use of any amount of overwhelming force to favor one of the endpoints over the other is considered morally justifiable.

Another way to describe this conception would be "asshole Superman."

It is not mythic, although it is — according to the myopic conception of right and wrong described above — idealistic. The years of the examples in question from Silver Age are below.

ACTION COMICS #258 (1959) by Otto Binder and Jim Mooney Cover by Curt Swan
Superman's Pal, Jimmy Olsen Vol 1 #30 August, 1958

TL;DR = Think Ward Cleaver disciplining "The Beaver" with the nuclear button.

Context:
Superman became increasingly irrelevant to many DC readers as the Silver Age wore on, hence the very reason the editors sought to remove Santa stench from the character toward the end of the 1960s. Readers (and comic creators) were no longer enamored of a character that was so childish and far removed from what was happening in other titles which were supposed to be in the same universe. [etc]

What you are describing is a shift from Superman primarily existing in his own expansive universe, and being primarily written for children of all ages, to being compressed to serve a larger DC universe and being written for an increasingly adult audience---and from being a more mythic figure to being simply one of many super heroes. In other words, the Marvelization of Superman. As to whether or not this was an improvement, ymmv.
 
Silver Age Superman was written for children primarily and falls apart if scrutinized by modern adult sensibilities---as do all funnybook heroes.

But for children--and adults who remember what it was like to be children--he was just the greatest.
 
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