Spoilers Lux grade and discussion thread

[David cgc]

I grew up in Miami, so I was interested to see what their recreation was like. Obviously, the '50s were a bit before my time, but the VFX shots seemed to capture old Miami Beach and the occasional throwback diner pretty well. Stadium seating in the movie house seemed unlikely, though. They even got the name of the county right on the police letter posted on the closed theater; in 1997, they changed the name of the county from "Dade" to "Miami-Dade," and a fair amount of films and television set in the '90s and earlier unknowingly use the new name. They also got it right that, unsually for America, Dade County has (well, had) a police department, where most counties call their law enforcement service a sheriff's department, with police departments existing for individual cities and towns.

I did have a disagreement with my sister. She thought the Doctor was saying the NYPD cop shouldn't be in "Miami-Dade county," though I heard it as "Miami, Dade county." She's probably right, RTD is the person who had the sitting President call himself the "president-elect," it's more plausible that he'd make that kind of error while the art department would've gone more in-depth in the research. Is the BBC still releasing the scripts for the episodes on-line? I guess I could check.

 

[Mr Awe]

I may be in the minority opinion but I think the "fans" scene while cute, actually brought down the episode a drop.
They said, oh we're the viewers but we're also extras...pick a lane lol.
8/10. Could have been better but, at least it's not SPACE BABIES.

Oh and Alan Cumming? YES PLEASE!

I agree. And it was kind of confusing too. For starters, they're kind of negative stereotypes of DW fans.

But beyond that, what were they? Characters in what? Did Lux create them or bring them to life? It's kind of implied (I think) that Lux brought them to life but they were acting under his radar by helping the Doctor. But that doesn't make sense really if they're scripted characters in a universe where Doctor Who is fictional (which is ours but yet we're not scripted).

In the end, I didn't mind them mentioning the exploding film. Yes, they mentioned that films can combust. But, how to use it? It wasn't to explode Lux directly, but instead to blow open the side of the theater to let the sunlight in. So, it was still a twist use of it.

A fun, Doctor lite episode, would be one where DW fans in our universe get transported to the Doctor's universe where he is real and they need to restore him somehow.

 

[Starkers]

I've seen a lot of people saying they were negative stereotypes of Who fans and I really don't get it. Stereotypical perhaps, but negative?

 

[Turtletrekker]

I didn't see any negative stereotyping with the Doctor Who fans.

 

[Mr Awe]

As they said themselves, they are annoying! It's pretty self-evident.

 

[Chakoteya]

<snip>

I did have a disagreement with my sister. She thought the Doctor was saying the NYPD cop shouldn't be in "Miami-Dade county," though I heard it as "Miami, Dade county." She's probably right, RTD is the person who had the sitting President call himself the "president-elect," it's more plausible that he'd make that kind of error while the art department would've gone more in-depth in the research. Is the BBC still releasing the scripts for the episodes on-line? I guess I could check.

Script Library - Whoniverse

Check out scripts and interviews with writers from across the Whoniverse

www.bbc.co.uk

But no, none of the Disney-Who scripts are being made available to the great unwashed, yet. You'd have to know what contracts were signed by who and when to work out whether they ever will, or if Disney have claimed intellectual rights in return for their money.

 

[Starkers]

As they said themselves, they are annoying! It's pretty self-evident.

We're all annoying to someone at some point

I mean though, if you were going with negative views of Who fans surely you'd have those gatekeeper types who jump on any fan who hasn't been watching since Hartnell, or those people for whom neither Jodie or Ncuti will ever be #theirdoctor for 'reasons'.

As with Love & Monsters what we had here was some people who maybe struggled in real life but who made friends and found a purpose in loving the show. I see zero negativity in that.

Are all Who fans like that? No, hence they were somewhat stereotypical geeky/possibly neurodiverse types, but negative?

 

[jaime]

We're all annoying to someone at some point

I mean though, if you were going with negative views of Who fans surely you'd have those gatekeeper types who jump on any fan who hasn't been watching since Hartnell, or those people for whom neither Jodie or Ncuti will ever be #theirdoctor for 'reasons'.

As with Love & Monsters what we had here was some people who maybe struggled in real life but who made friends and found a purpose in loving the show. I see zero negativity in that.

Are all Who fans like that? No, hence they were somewhat stereotypical geeky/possibly neurodiverse types, but negative?

Some of us still remember the Anorak presenting the documentary in the nineties. Def II The Daleks as it were.

 

[The Wormhole]

The fans seen in this episode are just a group of fans who enjoy watching Doctor Who nothing negative about that.

Though if you really want to get all about reactions to that scene, I saw someone get bent out of shape when the Doctor worried leaving them would result in their deaths, but the fans told him it was alright claiming "we don't matter." I'm seeing some people taking a visceral reaction to the fact the episode has white people basically saying their lives don't matter. Because there has to be someone who would look at it that way.

 

[jaime]

The fans seen in this episode are just a group of fans who enjoy watching Doctor Who nothing negative about that.

Though if you really want to get all about reactions to that scene, I saw someone get bent out of shape when the Doctor worried leaving them would result in their deaths, but the fans told him it was alright claiming "we don't matter." I'm seeing some people taking a visceral reaction to the fact the episode has white people basically saying their lives don't matter. Because there has to be someone who would look at it that way.

I thought it was a bit daft, yeah, but didn’t really focus on ethnicity of the fans. Or even that one was in a wheelchair, except to notice it wasn’t Tharries. It seems the nuttier ends of people are obsessed with race, whether it be to the left or right.

The only thing about race that bugged me in the episode (and more so other people I spoke to after if I am honest, though I could very much see their point hence mentioning tI here) is because we are going in on segregationist America in the story, it makes stringing the Doctor up less like it’s equivalent scene in the old TVM (always dress for the occasion) or power of the Doctor, and unpleasantly like a lynching scene. Shades of Watchmen TV series or — I imagine, I couldn’t be arsed sitting through it — American Gods. It can put a different spin on things, and something writers/producers sometimes need to have a care about. (As the people casting the Harry Potter series are finding out, as people rightly point out that ethnicity puts a different spin on certain relationships and events in that, and not necessarily in the way they think.)

 

[Mr Awe]

Are all Who fans like that? No, hence they were somewhat stereotypical geeky/possibly neurodiverse types, but negative?

The fans seen in this episode are just a group of fans who enjoy watching Doctor Who nothing negative about that.

Well, there's a split on this question. Personally, I don't think it was horribly negative but it did play on overused tropes. I'd call it a tired cliché more than anything else. But others saw it as more negative than I.

 

[marillion]

I give it a 9. Pure fun episode. I loved the fourth wall break and the conversation with the "fans." I WANT a Telos t-shirt.

I know there's some back and forth about using "Blink" as their favorite episode, but I don't have any problem with it. When they say "Blink," I'm betting every Who fan knows exactly what they're talking about. Another random episode title wouldn't have the same reaction. There are many titles that they could have used that I would have no recollection of. But a one word title like "Blink" stands out.

 

[David cgc]

The other thing is that "Blink" works for Belinda's unimpressed reaction in a way that, say, "Heaven Sent" or "City of Death" wouldn't. Maybe "Midnight" also hits the trifectica of beloved, easily summed up in a sentence, and sounding kind of crappy when you sum it up in a sentence.

Oh, and there’s also the fact that “Blink” is a Doctor-lite episode, so it’s funny that it’s a little insulting that their favorite episode is one of the few without him in it.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

I dunno, Heaven Sent would be a cool pick.

"its about the Doctor wandering around a rotating, empty castle for billions of years."

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

It would've been very on brand for a Pantheon member to remind the Doctor of some of his most traumatic experiences.

 

[Mr Awe]

I dunno, Heaven Sent would be a cool pick.

"its about the Doctor wandering around a rotating, empty castle for billions of years."

I liked Heaven Sent but it was let down by the subsequent episode sadly.

 

[Skipper]

Are all Who fans like that? No, hence they were somewhat stereotypical geeky/possibly neurodiverse types, but negative?

And, I mean, their idol showed up in their living room!

How would the average Star Trek fan react if the literal Captain Kirk (not Shatner, Kirk!) materialized in front of them?

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

I liked Heaven Sent but it was let down by the subsequent episode sadly.

I used to agree but no longer. Hell Bent is an incredible episode. But I digress.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

I liked Heaven Sent but it was let down by the subsequent episode sadly.

I disagree on that notion. While I agree "Hell Bent" is trash, I believe that "Heaven Sent" stands on its own without relying on what came after it. Likewise what can before it (less said "Face the Raven" the better, too).

But I also digress.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

Speaking of Hell Bent and this episode, here's Elizabeth Sandifer's summation of this episode: "Best episode since Hell Bent."

So there you go.