In hindsight do you wish TNG had ended with "All Good Things"?

[Lyonsbannor]

As to the original question about the movies, I'd say yes.

All Good Things was an uninspired ending, because it didn't actually end anything. Of course, production on Generations was already in the works, but both episodes could have fit anywhere in the last season as a two-parter and nobody would have known better. While it's not the worst way to end a series (*coughVoyagercough*) it certainly wasn't anywhere near an ending I would have accepted had a movie been an unlikely proposition.

The biggest problem was the ending. Nothing happened. Like, at all. This entire trial that Picard had could be put off to a bad dream. Nothing was affected. The crew went on. Picard was the only one with any knowledge of anything happening at all, and he's not even fazed by the idea that humanity and the entire universe was almost blinked out of existence because Q was bored that day. Nothing changes by the fact that these episodes existed.

The other problem was that it felt like a science fiction version of A Christmas Carol told from the perspective of the three ghosts. Q, through a series of flashbacks, trials and tribulations, being led on by the Ghosts of Past, Present, and Future Picard as he shows the joy of christm- value of humanity. While there are major differences in the stories, it seemed to draw some serious inspiration from the spirit of Dickens. Picard even wakes up at the end, and asks what day it was.

In the end, yes. The movies weren't the greatest. The damage they did to the franchise, at least to that timeline, was just the final blow in a long process of utter failure. Nemesis didn't kill Star Trek, it was just the coup de grace for an already fallen franchise, and as bad as it was, at least it was an ending.

 

[Phantom]

^On the contrary, at the end of AGT, things DID change. He became much more aware of his relationship with his crew, symbolized by his joining them for poker for the first time.

 

[Dukhat]

He became much more aware of his relationship with his crew, symbolized by his joining them for poker for the first time.

All of which was subsequently erased for the films, when it was decided they would be the Picard & Data Show.

 

[DonIago]

Like I said way back when in this thread, the only major reservation I have about AGT is that it is essentially a reset button episode (which bothers me a little more since it is the final episode), though people seem to be generally forgiving of that.

 

[JesterFace]

though people seem to be generally forgiving of that.

When it comes to forgiving something in 'All Good Things..', it must be the static warp cell, how in the hell can anyone (in this case Data) predict that forming something like that will separate time lines and seal the subspace barrier, whatever that is... the solution in AGT is way too technobablish. It nearly ruins the entire thing for me...

 

[Lyonsbannor]

^On the contrary, at the end of AGT, things DID change. He became much more aware of his relationship with his crew, symbolized by his joining them for poker for the first time.

That's not really a major change, but just the same kind of character development we see over and over again from pretty much every episode of TNG. It isn't an ending, and like someone mentioned, it's pretty much a moot point by Generations, where the focus is on Picard being The Captain again, isolating himself from his crew. It's a theme that keeps echoing on in every movie.

 

[suarezguy]

The biggest problem was the ending. Nothing happened. Like, at all. This entire trial that Picard had could be put off to a bad dream. Nothing was affected. The crew went on. Picard was the only one with any knowledge of anything happening at all, and he's not even fazed by the idea that humanity and the entire universe was almost blinked out of existence because Q was bored that day.

Although I might have preferred that the present Enterprise crew survived their experiences, Picard choosing to inform his crew about what could happen was pretty significant and the others did reflect on it. Also Q claims, and I think is meant to be believed, that destroying humanity was the continuum's orders rather than his idea. Picard could have been a bit more shaken up that he was in some sense responsible but it was inadvertent and he'd already had lots of traumas.

The other problem was that it felt like a science fiction version of A Christmas Carol told from the perspective of the three ghosts. Q, through a series of flashbacks, trials and tribulations, being led on by the Ghosts of Past, Present, and Future Picard as he shows the joy of christm- value of humanity. While there are major differences in the stories, it seemed to draw some serious inspiration from the spirit of Dickens. Picard even wakes up at the end, and asks what day it was.

I don't see why having those influences/echoes is so bad, I thought showing all three time periods led to great reviews of how the characters had and could change.

 

[JesterFace]

I think 'All Good Things' was a good last episode, because not much if anything changed and why anything should change? Enterprise continues its mission and everything is fine.

DS9 and other programs that end with everything changing, I don't think that's cool. Then you are left to wonder, what might happen next? For example, what wacky things happen with O'Brien in his new post or some one else from DS9? That leaves too much questions flying around.

 

[Lyonsbannor]

I think 'All Good Things' was a good last episode, because not much if anything changed and why anything should change? Enterprise continues its mission and everything is fine.

I don't have a problem with that considering you get the movies afterwards. I would have had a problem with it if the movies didn't continue. I don't hate the episode, it just wasn't much of an ending.

DS9 and other programs that end with everything changing, I don't think that's cool. Then you are left to wonder, what might happen next? For example, what wacky things happen with O'Brien in his new post or some one else from DS9? That leaves too much questions flying around.

And blindly flying around after the status quo has been achieved again doesn't? There's no wrap-up, the loose ends are still all there. What happens now? Where does Enterprise go? Will Riker ever get his command? Does Data ever finally become human-like and gain the emotions he wants so badly? There were so many threads that were not even attempted to be wrapped up that having it end like that would have been about as satisfying as the Sopranos wrap-up, had there been no movie.

 

[JesterFace]

I think 'All Good Things' was a good last episode, because not much if anything changed and why anything should change? Enterprise continues its mission and everything is fine.

I don't have a problem with that considering you get the movies afterwards. I would have had a problem with it if the movies didn't continue. I don't hate the episode, it just wasn't much of an ending.

People are different. I think 'All Good Things...' was a great ending for the show. Also, I don't like or want to watch any of the TNG films anymore, so...

DS9 and other programs that end with everything changing, I don't think that's cool. Then you are left to wonder, what might happen next? For example, what wacky things happen with O'Brien in his new post or some one else from DS9? That leaves too much questions flying around.

And blindly flying around after the status quo has been achieved again doesn't? There's no wrap-up, the loose ends are still all there.

But, does TNG even need a wrap-up, I don't think so. Series with continuing story lines maybe... but for me TNG finale was a proper ending.

 

[Lucky]

I'm glad the films were made, as First Contact is my 3rd favorite Star Trek film. And while the other films had problems, I did like seeing Riker and Troi married in Nemesis and Riker get his own command.