Best version of 1927's Metropolis?

[Tribble puncher]

I know there are several "cut's" of this film of varying lengths.
I'm trying to find the most complete, definitive version of the film, supposedly, there was some lost footage of the film found a few years back or something, there's a ton of information on the various versions of this film, and some of it is conflicting. I'm thinking of getting the "Kino" Restored version on BLU-Ray, as it's the one that seems to have all the lost footage and would technically be the most complete version, and the buying the Moroder version (with the color and 80's soundtrack added in) as a companion piece. I figured I'd ask around here for the best version of the film to purchase on DVD/BLU-Ray seeing as I trust the opinions of several of the posters here. Thanks.

 

[The Laughing Vulcan]

This

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https://www.amazon.co.uk/TEZUKAS-ME...1509624638&sr=1-3&keywords=metropolis+blu+ray
is all the Metropolis you could ever need!

 

[Mudd]

Well, speaking of Queen, Moroder's version was a thing briefly in the '80s - but then, so was heavy drinking and coke which kind of explains it...

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[Starbreaker]

Metropolis Restored is on Netflix.

This is the best version available at the moment
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Metropolis-Blu-ray/8710/

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I have the 2010 Kino blu-ray version. It was actually my very first blu-ray, an excuse to get into blu-ray in fact.

An interesting movie with very few intertitles, though I have seen very few silent movies.

I have to say, the 16mm Argentina footage adds very little to the overall story and kinda takes me out of the story a little.

It's a pretty jarring transition from the original (39.5MM?) to the grainy 16mm.

 

[ChasFink]

I politely disagree with Ar-Pharazon. The version Starbreaker recommends is by far the closest to the original (if a definitive "original" version can be said to have ever existed). The Argentina scenes are VERY deteriorated, and at least one small sequence is still lost, but it is more than anything else available in the last 50 years. The Moroder version is an interesting contrast, and closer to what we all were familiar with before the massive reconstructions. The color is nice, but you may prefer to watch it without the modern soundtrack.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I politely disagree with Ar-Pharazon.

With which part? I didn't make a recommendation, just giving my opinion of the version I have.

 

[tomswift2002]

The Kino version from 2010 is the best version out there, as it contains the most footage. One thing that you have to realize though is that the Arentinian footage is from 16mm film and was transferred in the 1970's incorrectly. In the 1970's whoever transferred the film was obviously unaware that the film was a silent film, and therefore left the sound gate open on the 16mm machine, thus the picture is missing about a 1/3 of the frame. Also they didn't clean the original nitrate film in the 1970's, so all the dust and dirt that had accumulated on the print between the 1920's and 1970's was "preserved" on the 16mm print for all time. And on one of the special features the restoration team talks about the possibility of digitally cleaning the 16mm print, but they found that there was just too much to touch up digitally, that it would get tot he point where they felt everyone watching it would say that it looked too digital. So they did clean it up as best they could, but the 16mm footage still looks extremely poor, compared to the Paramount footage that is all that is left of an original film print.

And the Blu-ray also contains different angles for different scenes. Apparenlty, from what the restoration team can tell, the different prints that were issued in the 1920's all contained different angles of different scenes.

 

[ChasFink]

I politely disagree with Ar-Pharazon.

With which part? I didn't make a recommendation, just giving my opinion of the version I have.

Apologies. I took "adds very little to the overall story and kinda takes me out of the story a little" to be a tacit recommendation of the previous restored version. I see now that wasn't your intent.

Apparenlty, from what the restoration team can tell, the different prints that were issued in the 1920's all contained different angles of different scenes.

This is what I was alluding to when I said there really might not ever have been a definitive version. In the silent era, multiple takes - sometimes shot side-by-side simultaneously - were edited into multiple masters of the "same" film. Prints were also sometimes edited to meet local demands for censorship.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Apologies. I took "adds very little to the overall story and kinda takes me out of the story a little" to be a tacit recommendation of the previous restored version. I see now that wasn't your intent.


This is what I was alluding to when I said there really might not ever have been a definitive version. In the silent era, multiple takes - sometimes shot side-by-side simultaneously - were edited into multiple masters of the "same" film. Prints were also sometimes edited to meet local demands for censorship.

Hell, I might get a blu-ray of the previous version, just so I can see the movie without those 16mm parts. Not that I didn't enjoy the version I have, but like I said, a little distracting.

My hope is there's an uncut original somewhere in the world. A copy of Hello Pop was found a few years ago, and the last known copy of that one was lost in the MGM vault fire 50 years ago.

 

[marillion]

I would have to say that the 90th Anniversary Boxed Set features just about anything and everything you'd want. This for me is/are the definitive version(s)... I'm SOOOOO wanting this... I'm guessing it's about $50 US? I don't know the conversion...

ETA.. Just did the conversion... Even better.. It's just under $40.... Christmas is coming!!!

 

[ChasFink]

I would have to say that the 90th Anniversary Boxed Set features just about anything and everything you'd want. This for me is/are the definitive version(s)... I'm SOOOOO wanting this... I'm guessing it's about $50 US? I don't know the conversion...

ETA.. Just did the conversion... Even better.. It's just under $40.... Christmas is coming!!!

Warning to others in the US who might want this - an American edition does not seem available, so you'd need a blu-ray system that plays UK discs. US editions of the three versions included do exist.

 

[tomswift2002]

Hell, I might get a blu-ray of the previous version, just so I can see the movie without those 16mm parts. Not that I didn't enjoy the version I have, but like I said, a little distracting.

My hope is there's an uncut original somewhere in the world. A copy of Hello Pop was found a few years ago, and the last known copy of that one was lost in the MGM vault fire 50 years ago.

As far as I am aware, there are only 2 Blu-Rays out there, the 2010 restored version, and the 1980’s Moroder Version.

As for an uncut original, the problem is that after Paramount did their edits in 1927 (which included using chemicals on the original film to create fades and dips to black), the German production company recalled all the prints that had been released and edited them to more closely match the Paramount edit (and the original had only been in release for a short while, so most of the prints had only been sent to places in Europe around Germany) So all the original camera negatives have been mutilated. Also the original negative used nitrate film which combusts very easily (this is why the Argentinian government had the 16mm version made—-do that they could get rid of the nitrate film). Plus with WWII, any duplicates were either destroyed or were looted by the invading armies when they were dividing Germany up after the war. So unless it comes to light that some other country’s film distributor managed to get a copy of the original cut, then the 16mm version is all that’s left of the cut scenes.

And ChasFrink, you might want to double check your sources. Both Amazon.com and .ca list the 2010 Kino Edition as available for Americans and Canadians.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

As far as I am aware, there are only 2 Blu-Rays out there, the 2010 restored version, and the 1980’s Moroder Version.

As for an uncut original, the problem is that after Paramount did their edits in 1927 (which included using chemicals on the original film to create fades and dips to black), the German production company recalled all the prints that had been released and edited them to more closely match the Paramount edit (and the original had only been in release for a short while, so most of the prints had only been sent to places in Europe around Germany) So all the original camera negatives have been mutilated. Also the original negative used nitrate film which combusts very easily (this is why the Argentinian government had the 16mm version made—-do that they could get rid of the nitrate film). Plus with WWII, any duplicates were either destroyed or were looted by the invading armies when they were dividing Germany up after the war. So unless it comes to light that some other country’s film distributor managed to get a copy of the original cut, then the 16mm version is all that’s left of the cut scenes.

And ChasFrink, you might want to double check your sources. Both Amazon.com and .ca list the 2010 Kino Edition as available for Americans and Canadians.

Yeah, the point that the prints were in Germany across WWII makes it unlikely any copies there could have survived. But it being such an early time period, and recordkeeping being somewhat poor, I'll hold out a little hope.

What you said about the flammability of nitrate was what made the MGM fire such a complete disaster.

Extinguishing (or not so much) A Nitrate Film Fire-

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[tomswift2002]

What you said about the flammability of nitrate was what made the MGM fire such a complete disaster.

From what I've read, it was because of the flammability of nitrate film that the air conditioning business was, more or less, formed. Apparently back in the 1910's and 1920's in Southern California, a number of studios actually had major fires due to films just bursting into flame from the rise of temperature during the day. Plus a number of theaters across the world were burnt to the ground at the time because the heat from the projector bulb would cause the film to burst into flame while the movie was playing.

But even with "poor record keeping", the timeline for the film also plays a major role in figuring how many copies could've been made. Metropolis debuted in Berlin in January 1927. Paramount debuted the highly-truncated version in March 1927 to both US and UK audiences. The original cut was still in German theaters by April 1927, at which point it was withdrawn, and re-edited to be similar to the Paramount edit, and the edited German version debuted in August 1927.

Also in the mid-2000's copies were found in Australia and New Zealand, however these copies appeared to have been sourced from the Argentinian print and seem to have been in about the same condition as the 16mm Argentinian print, although a few scenes that were heavily damaged in the Argentinian print were able to be recovered from the Australia and New Zealand prints. Apparently all 3 copies had the same damage to the 2 scenes that could not be recovered.

 

[ChasFink]

And ChasFrink, you might want to double check your sources. Both Amazon.com and .ca list the 2010 Kino Edition as available for Americans and Canadians.

Sorry to reply so late. I wasn't referring to the 2010 Kino version, but to the 90th Anniversary Box Set. I did say that the versions in the box set were available in North American editions.