Who Would You Like to Have Seen More of?

[C_Miller]

I love TNG. I remember being four or five years old watching the first airings of TNG episodes. I vaguely recall watching episodes like Cause and Effect, Power Play, and The First Duty with my Dad who was a big fan and I remember being especially excited when All Good Things came on, knowing the significants of it. That's so you don't question my fandom. Now the one problem I always had with TNG was the lack of recurring characters.

I know there was O'Brien, Q, Mrs. Troi, Barclay, Ro, Guinan, ect. But to me, they lack the cohesiveness of the recurring characters on Deep Space Nine (which is a series I'm working through now). One of the things I love about their characters is that they show how big the station actually is. On TNG, for the most part, the episode is built around the character and then they fall into obscurity until they next time they are featured.

On DS9, characters like Rom, Garak, Nog, Martok, Keiko, Leeta, Dukat, Damar, Weyoun, ect all show up to support the plot of episodes rather than become the plot of episodes constantly. I mean every episode that Q, Barclay or Mrs. Troi showed up in were their episodes, while Ro and Guinan was pretty darn close to that. The obvious exception to this rule is O'Brien who was a great supporting character and was given room to be featured in some episodes.

Anywho, I wish there were more recurring characters that showed up to give the show more of a scale to the ship and to the universe as a whole. What characters would you like to have seen more of and what would you have done with them?

 

[Joeman]

Ro Laren. I'd make her into a main character and have A story lines revolving around her just like the other main characters.

It's too bad O'Brien's character didn't develop more on TNG. He played a big part in some of DS9's best episodes.

 

[zephramc]

I would have liked to see Ensign Sito Jaxa show up in more episodes. Maybe feature her in 8-9 S7 episodes then punch the audience in the gut with "Below Decks".

Besides Sito, I would have liked to see more of Tom Riker (I realize it's still Jonathan Frakes). I think the character could have been interesting.

 

[C_Miller]

Ro Laren. I'd make her into a main character and have A story lines revolving around her just like the other main characters.

It's too bad O'Brien's character didn't develop more on TNG. He played a big part in some of DS9's best episodes.

As much as I'm not a fan of TNG's recurring cast, I'd say O'Brien is the perfect example of what I wanted, although I would have liked to see more of it. I mean, he appeared in the first episode as a no-name red shirt at the conn, then he got a steady job as transporter chief, then he got a rank and last name, then he got a first name, then he got a middle name, then he got married, then he had a daughter and then he got his own show. I'd argue that he had a lot more development than Doctor Crusher or Geordi, sadly. It's funny how he went from extra to my second favorite character on DS9 (after Odo).

 

[Joeman]

You're correct, and I chose my words poorly. Obviously he did develop quite a bit on TNG. I guess I was thinking more along the lines of wishing he had developed more quickly, and played a bigger part in the show through more of the run. Thankfully we got our O'Brien fix on DS9 though.

I would like to have seen a lot more Dr. Pulaski.

More Captain Jellico. Maybe he pops up from time to time to butt heads with Picard and the Enterprise crew. Maybe some joint missions or something.

Loved Moriarty, but not sure how much more could have been done with him.

More Ensign Robin Lefler. Not sure I'd want to keep her as a love interest for Wesley. Not unless they suddenly decided to stop writing Wesley as a complete goober. Ashley Judd was a cutie though.

Definitely more Barclay. I think the show could have easily benefited from his having a larger role. Not necessarily a main character, but maybe the frequency of say, Rom on DS9.

 

[Teiwaz]

More Captain Jellico. Maybe he pops up from time to time to butt heads with Picard and the Enterprise crew. Maybe some joint missions or something.

Captain Jellico - He was the anti-Picard.
Think about it - had a family, didn't like fish, didn't like Riker, was brash and rather seemingly rash and at the end of the episode it felt like he left in disgrace.

More Ensign Robin Lefler. Not sure I'd want to keep her as a love interest for Wesley. Not unless they suddenly decided to stop writing Wesley as a complete goober. Ashley Judd was a cutie though.

Plus she was a quirky character, with her rules and 'genki' outlook.

Definitely more Barclay. I think the show could have easily benefited from his having a larger role. Not necessarily a main character, but maybe the frequency of say, Rom on DS9.

Amen to that (as if prayer could be retroactive).

 

[Whoa Nellie]

This will come as no great surprise to anyone here. I would have loved to have seen more of Vash as a reoccurring civilian love interest for Picard (no pesky fraternization or chain of command issues with this pairing) similar to Sisko and Kasidy Yates. Would they have shown more of Vash's academic side or more of the adventuress? Would they have put her on dig sites or in lecture halls?

I've always seen the Picard/Vash relationship as an homage to the great romantic film pairings of the 40's. Vash is Bacall to Picard's Bogart. The very compelling 'battle of wills' dynamic to the Picard/Vash relationship is reminiscent of Bogart and Bacall in the movie "To Have and Have Not." The classic is one of my all time favorite movies. For you youngsters on the board who may have no idea what movie I'm talking about, "To Have and Have Not" is the film where Bacall's character famously tells Bogart's character, "You know you don't have to act with me, Steve. You don't have to say anything, and you don't have to do anything. Not a thing. Oh, maybe just whistle. You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? You just put your lips together and... blow."

Vash's brazenness complements Picard's more sedate personality perfectly. She is the ideal foil for Picard's straight man. The characterizations and relationship dynamics between Picard and Vash makes this pairing a pure joy to watch.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

 

[RegFan]

Definitely more Barclay. I think the show could have easily benefited from his having a larger role. Not necessarily a main character, but maybe the frequency of say, Rom on DS9.

I agree. He's my all-time favorite Trek character. I wouldn't want him to be a main character, but I'd love it if he appeared in about 20 episodes, with most of them having his role be like in Genesis (having some plot importance but not like in his three first episodes). He would certainly have to develop into the genius he was in Voyager.

I think that Ro Laren would have been great as a main character but the actress would probably refuse (she was supposed to be on both DS9 and VOY).

Jellico would have made a nice recurring character.

 

[Teiwaz]

This will come as no great surprise to anyone here. I would have loved to have seen more of Vash as a reoccurring civilian love interest for Picard (no pesky fraternization or chain of command issues with this pairing) similar to Sisko and Kasidy Yates. Would they have shown more of Vash's academic side or more of the adventuress? Would they have put her on dig sites or in lecture halls?

I've always seen the Picard/Vash relationship as an homage to the great romantic film pairings of the 40's. Vash is Bacall to Picard's Bogart. The very compelling 'battle of wills' dynamic to the Picard/Vash relationship is reminiscent of Bogart and Bacall in the movie "To Have and Have Not." The classic is one of my all time favorite movies. For you youngsters on the board who may have no idea what movie I'm talking about, "To Have and Have Not" is the film where Bacall's character famously tells Bogart's character, "You know you don't have to act with me, Steve. You don't have to say anything, and you don't have to do anything. Not a thing. Oh, maybe just whistle. You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? You just put your lips together and... blow."

Vash's brazenness complements Picard's more sedate personality perfectly. She is the ideal foil for Picard's straight man. The characterizations and relationship dynamics between Picard and Vash makes this pairing a pure joy to watch.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

Unless he just arbitrarily decided their relationship might be 'inappropriate' given that she had a naughty thieving streak.

What reason could be given for writing her in more permanently though? She wouldn't be satisfied as a mere wife or mistress (well, not for long), she couldn't be crew, or civvy (as Keiko O'Brien) - she'd only come to a sticky end and Picard has to be forced off the ship at phaser-point in order to take a holiday so a repeat of her intro episode is out of the question for a steamy rendez-vous.

 

[Admiral Shran]

Bok - I would have loved to see him trying to vengence on Picard more often than the two we got.

Lore - Woefully underused character. He should have popped up at least once a season.

Barclay - Who doesn't love Barclay?

Moriarty - A great character, but I'm not sure how they would have worked him into more episodes.

Ro - The show needed much more of the conflict she offered.

Tomalak - The greatest villian in TNG. He also should have popped up at least once a season.

Spot - You gotta love that pesky he/she cat.

 

[Whoa Nellie]

Unless he just arbitrarily decided their relationship might be 'inappropriate' given that she had a naughty thieving streak.

It didn't seem to bother him in the episode "Qpid." When Vash breaks into the captain's quarters, does Picard call security? No. He has her spend the night with him and feeds her breakfast the next morning.

This woman is too cool!

Edited to add: Vash acts much the way the other archaeologist shown in TNG act. According to canon, before meeting Picard on Risa she spent five years working as a personal assistant to Professor Samuel Estragon, an archaeologist who's work Picard knew. It was Professor Samuel Estragon who was originally hunting for the Tox Uthat. It was also Professor Samuel Estragon who hired the Ferengi Sovak to aid in his explorations, especially in situations that weren't quite ethical. Moreover, Picard isn't surprised at all and is amused by the idea. (3rd season episode Captain Holiday.)

Also in the 6th season episode "The Chase," Picard's own mentor Professor Galen comes aboard the Enterprise and attempts to BRIBE the captain with a Kurlan naiskos, very rare archaeological artifact, wanting Picard to leave his captaincy to become Galen's muscle.

GALEN
"... I'm sorry, Mister Picard. But that information has a price --your agreement to join me on the final leg of this expedition."

PICARD
"For how long?"

GALEN
"Three months. Perhaps a year. If we had a starship and complete diplomatic access -- a matter of weeks. But we'll have only my shuttle, the transports we can arrange, and our combined talents."

PICARD
"Why can't you do this without me?"

GALEN
"I'm not a young man. There will be hazards along the way. I don't want my own inadequacies to jeopardize the completion of this work."

In this episode Professor Galen is operating exactly the way we were told that Professor Samuel Estragon did and the way Vash did. Therefore, it is a believable extrapolation from series canon that fieldwork in interstellar archaeology can be a somewhat rough and tumble, wild wild west like business.

What reason could be given for writing her in more permanently though?

It's called drama.

“The essence of plot structure is: struggle—therefore, conflict—therefore, climax. A struggle implies two opposing forces in conflict, and it implies a climax. The climax is the central point of the story, where the conflict is resolved.” Ayn Rand

In my opinion, Vash is one of those underutilized characters with a virtual goldmine of untapped potential.

Remember Sisko had to arrest Kasidy Yates for smuggling supplies to the Maquis.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

 

[Teiwaz]

What reason could be given for writing her in more permanently though?

It's called drama.

“The essence of plot structure is: struggle—therefore, conflict—therefore, climax. A struggle implies two opposing forces in conflict, and it implies a climax. The climax is the central point of the story, where the conflict is resolved.” Ayn Rand

Well, that answers my question in a not answering kind of way - Well Done -
(have you thought of going into politics?)
- But please, struggle, conflict, climax and Jean Luc Picard - I feel queasy

In my opinion, Vash is one of those underutilized characters with a virtual goldmine of untapped potential.

Remember Sisko had to arrest Kasidy Yates for smuggling supplies to the Maquis.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

I agree, Vash has/had potential, and yes, I've been rewatching DS9 lately, and coincidentally that particular episode was viewed last night so I was more than aware of it, I didn't mention it as Sisko is a different person to Picard, he comes across more morally flexible than Picard does so I didn't want to set story precedent by bringing it up.

What I meant was (and I thought I had made it clear with the last passage of my post (but everybody seems to be misconstruing me today) is...
Okay, Kasidy Yates is not a weekly appearing character, but, from several episodes before that ep where she is arrested she's been living on station (at least some of the time), the reason written into the story allowing the drama to include her more often without significant back-story is that she is working for the Bajorans and using DS9 as a base and now has an apartment.
What way would you use/or have used to write Vash into the TNG cast so she could appear in more episodes, given that the Enterprise cannot ALWAYS be hosting Acheologists sympsoiums or in orbit over some ancient yet forbidden site and Picard hardly ever takes a holiday.

 

[Whoa Nellie]

What way would you use/or have used to write Vash into the TNG cast so she could appear in more episodes, given that the Enterprise cannot ALWAYS be hosting Acheologists sympsoiums or in orbit over some ancient yet forbidden site and Picard hardly ever takes a holiday.

As I said Vash is one of those underutilized characters with a virtual goldmine of untapped potential. The possibilities are endless. Would they have shown more of Vash's academic side or more of the adventuress? Would they have put her on dig sites or in lecture halls? With Picard's interest in archaeology, would she be his ticket to visit archaeology sites that piqued his interest. (I'm fairly certain that most archeology digs don't let 'enthusiastic amateurs' nose around without an invite.) Would we see her being used as a freelance archaeologist? (How would the Gambit have been changed if Vash had been an archaeologist on one of the sites that had been attacked?) Would she be attached to the Enterprise or come and go as she pleases meeting up with the Enterprise when it docks? (There are plenty of characters mentioned in this thread that would not live on the Enterprise) I'm assuming you’re a B-5 fan (due to your Techno-mage reference) so think of first season B-5, Jeffrey Sinclair and Catherine Sakai.


After over a decade of writing fanfiction with the Picard/Vash pairing, I can tell you that Vash's character fits in easily with the crew as a civilian scientist. I have two TNG storylines; the Double Entendre Universe which accept all TNG canon through the movie "Generations" while adding Vash onboard as the ship's chief archaeologist and the Reasons of the Heart Universe which accept all TNG canon through the movie "Insurrection" while adding Vash onboard as the ship's chief archaeologist. I write her as, to paraphrase a line slightly, a Doctor of Archaeology, expert on the Gamma Quadrant, obtainer of rare antiquities. The characterizations and relationship dynamics established in TNG canon for the Picard/Vash pairing work so flawlessly and flow so easily that it is a pure joy to write this pairing.

I always wondered how the Vash character might have been utilized more in the show, with my P/V fanfic simply being my own speculation.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

 

[Deckerd]

I think the producers offered Michelle Forbes (Ro Laren) a recurring role more than once but she turned them down, so that's one you can't blame on them.

 

[Pemmer Harge]

Ro and Guinan.

 

[WillsBabe]

I would have liked to have seen more Ro. I liked her because he was so different to the standard TNG characters, and I really liked the spark she had with Riker. Same with Shelby. I would liked to have seen more of her. There is a successful a/u somwhere out there in which she's Riker's XO and where the two of them run a tight ship.

Sito Jaxa was a great character for me; tough, thoughtful. Raw material I would have loved to have watched form and develop. I think she could have been awesome.

Sam Lavelle, I think had potential. He was certainly pretty enough to have seen more of.

 

[KobayashiMaru13]

Ro was pretty kick-ass. she should have been around more, and Barclay too. Lore and Tomalak as well. oh, and maybe have had Bashir drop in more than once. liked him on DS9.

 

[Joeman]

I can't disagree with any characters anyone has mentioned, even Spot.

There could have been an episode in which Enterprise comes across an alien race that, as it turns out, can only communicate with Spot. Lots of things they could have done with that one, although it's extremely difficult to get a cat to "act".

 

[Teiwaz]

What way would you use/or have used to write Vash into the TNG cast so she could appear in more episodes, given that the Enterprise cannot ALWAYS be hosting Acheologists sympsoiums or in orbit over some ancient yet forbidden site and Picard hardly ever takes a holiday.

As I said Vash is one of those underutilized characters with a virtual goldmine of untapped potential. The possibilities are endless. Would they have shown more of Vash's academic side or more of the adventuress? Would they have put her on dig sites or in lecture halls? With Picard's interest in archaeology, would she be his ticket to visit archaeology sites that piqued his interest. (I'm fairly certain that most archeology digs don't let 'enthusiastic amateurs' nose around without an invite.) Would we see her being used as a freelance archaeologist? (How would the Gambit have been changed if Vash had been an archaeologist on one of the sites that had been attacked?) Would she be attached to the Enterprise or come and go as she pleases meeting up with the Enterprise when it docks? (There are plenty of characters mentioned in this thread that would not live on the Enterprise) I'm assuming you’re a B-5 fan (due to your Techno-mage reference) so think of first season B-5, Jeffrey Sinclair and Catherine Sakai.

Okay.
The Jeffrey Sinclair / Sakai relationship was always a bit of an enigma (ignoring the books which attempts to clear up what actually happened) in that both just disappear, Sinclair is seen again but Sakai just disappears. Had Sinclair not been 'the closed circle' though I often wonder what might have happened since they got engaged just before the assassination of the President. Arg - don't get me started -

After over a decade of writing fanfiction with the Picard/Vash pairing, I can tell you that Vash's character fits in easily with the crew as a civilian scientist. I have two TNG storylines; the Double Entendre Universe which accept all TNG canon through the movie "Generations" while adding Vash onboard as the ship's chief archaeologist and the Reasons of the Heart Universe which accept all TNG canon through the movie "Insurrection" while adding Vash onboard as the ship's chief archaeologist. I write her as, to paraphrase a line slightly, a Doctor of Archaeology, expert on the Gamma Quadrant, obtainer of rare antiquities. The characterizations and relationship dynamics established in TNG canon for the Picard/Vash pairing work so flawlessly and flow so easily that it is a pure joy to write this pairing.

I always wondered how the Vash character might have been utilized more in the show, with my P/V fanfic simply being my own speculation.

Warmest Wishes,
Whoa Nellie

Touchy, sheesh.
I wasn't questioning your sanity, I was merely interested in how you saw Vash being written into the story on a more regular basis.

 

[Whoa Nellie]

Touchy, sheesh.
I wasn't questioning your sanity, I was merely interested in how you saw Vash being written into the story on a more regular basis.

You asked me a question:

What way would you use/or have used to write Vash into the TNG cast so she could appear in more episodes, given that the Enterprise cannot ALWAYS be hosting Acheologists sympsoiums or in orbit over some ancient yet forbidden site and Picard hardly ever takes a holiday.

and I answered.

Whoa Nellie