What Happens If None of the Govt. Bailouts Work?

[Squiggy]

If the U.S. is going to have to fight a war to pull out of depression, then this time we had better make it a war of conquest to seize valuable resources.

Such as Saudi Arabia.

Control of Saudi oil fields would give the U.S. years of breathing space to work on alternative fuels down the road.

Let the Saudis keep Mecca and Medina of course.

I'm sure that's not the worst idea in the history of time or anything. Well done.

 

[T'Baio]

If the U.S. is going to have to fight a war to pull out of depression, then this time we had better make it a war of conquest to seize valuable resources.

Such as Saudi Arabia.

Control of Saudi oil fields would give the U.S. years of breathing space to work on alternative fuels down the road.

Let the Saudis keep Mecca and Medina of course.

Yes, "let them." Holy Jeebus...

 

[Squiggy]

You'd think that...he being a history teacher and all...he'd know that sort of shit was the reasoning behind 9/11.

 

[bigdaddy]

If the U.S. is going to have to fight a war to pull out of depression, then this time we had better make it a war of conquest to seize valuable resources.

Such as Saudi Arabia.

Control of Saudi oil fields would give the U.S. years of breathing space to work on alternative fuels down the road.

Let the Saudis keep Mecca and Medina of course.

I'm sure that's not the worst idea in the history of time or anything. Well done.

It's not, he let them keep Mecca.

And have I been in a coma for years and years? I swear here was this war in Iraq and it was all because of oil. Maybe I'm dreaming.

 

[Squiggy]

It's not, he let them keep Mecca.

Oh, well then never mind. How generous and decent of him!

 

[Cutter John]

I'm sure that's not the worst idea in the history of time or anything. Well done.

Nah. The worst is still 'Starting a land war in Asia.'

 

[Squiggy]

Guess where the middle-east is.

 

[Dayton3]

Guess where the middle-east is.

And Korea.

 

[Squiggy]

And Vietnam.

 

[Terengo]

I'm not sure I would mind. I've long believed that an economy based on the manipulation of debt and the need for constant market expansion was ultimately unsustainable. If this is what it takes to get us on track to a better solution, then I'm willing to bite the bullet and ride it out.

I agree.

I think if it gets us away from the idea that the govt. is supposed to manipulate the economy to ease economic problems it might be worth it.

That's not quite what I meant. From where I sit, much of this crisis is due to bank and corporate deregulation that allowed all these "creative" debt instruments to arise. For too long, the economy has been a sort of Ponzi scheme where debt is re-packaged for sale to generate more debt. To me, the ideal situation would be to return to an economy based on actual production and not on speculation.

I think it is true that just pouring money into the system without fixing the flaws is doomed to fail.

 

[John Picard]

If the U.S. is going to have to fight a war to pull out of depression, then this time we had better make it a war of conquest to seize valuable resources.

Such as Saudi Arabia.

Control of Saudi oil fields would give the U.S. years of breathing space to work on alternative fuels down the road.

Let the Saudis keep Mecca and Medina of course.

and I say again

 

[Holdfast]

To me, the ideal situation would be to return to an economy based on actual production and not on speculation.

It's difficult to see how that could come about without a return to the gold standard. While all money is fiat, there's no such thing as an economy based on actual production.

And using a gold standard, while having some potential theoretical benefits, would incapacitate a modern economy... it would actually be the equivalent of a "credit crunch to the nth degree".

 

[Terengo]

To me, the ideal situation would be to return to an economy based on actual production and not on speculation.

It's difficult to see how that could come about without a return to the gold standard. While all money is fiat, there's no such thing as an economy based on actual production.

Well then, an economy based on manufacturing, and not on parasitic investments. Credit default swaps, for example, should be the first thing to go, especially for parties without an actual stake in the original transaction. Mortgage-backed securities aren't looking like such a bright idea anymore, either.

 

[Holdfast]

^ one person's parasitic investment is another person's way of coping with risk. Sweeping measures to ban investment types rarely work; they just build distortions into the system. And sometimes things have to fail, to fix the problem. I'd personally say free market systems are the least-worst, but bubbles and burstings are inevitable within it.

What Happens If None of the Govt. Bailouts Work?

I guess we're going to find out very soon...

... seriously, I never thought I'd see the USA with (virtually) zero interest rates. I'm half-hoping the Bank of England follows suit. It would be nice to see one of my mortgages disappear into the ether, and the other become minimal. Not good for the overall economy, but fuck it, this is every man for himself!