TVH - Scotty and the computer

[Crewman47]

Something that got me thinking about when we see the scene where Scotty is setting up the formula for the Transparent Aluminum on the computer is that he does everything from the main desktop to the end result in the space of a few minutes and all with keystrokes, no mouse use at all.

Can someone explain how he did what he did with nothing but keystrokes and how he was able to do it so quickly on, from his perspective, an old fashioned computer that he should have very knowledge of how to operate? Also is it actually possible to do everything like what Scotty did on a computer with only keystrokes, I mean I know you can do alot with keystrokes, (I know I can) but don't you still need a mouse for some things?

 

[Jon1701]

The gag worked 20 years ago, but with the advancement in computer technology that moment does look a little odd now.

The idea is to show that Scotty is a whizz with machines, nothing more. I just chalk it up to the passage of time.

 

[cultcross]

Essentially everything on a computer can be done using keyboard alone (games being the biggest exceptions) - I know from when my mouse routinely breaks on me You can even surf the net using the keyboard, tabbing between links.
However why you would chose to do so with a perfectly working mouse is beyond me - its usually cumbersome and takes time. Of course Scotty hadn't encountered a mouse before so perhaps he wouldn't have realsied there was a simpler way. As it was, there was no way the minimal amount of typing Scotty did could generate a full chemical design of a molecule, but thats dramatic licence, to keep the interest of the moment, rather than cut away for 20 minutes, get back, Scotty's still at it, and the directors beginning to discuss his labor day weekend plans with Madeline.

 

[zephramc]

First of all it was a 300 year old machine (a Macintosh if memory serves) from Scotty's perspective. Second it was an O/S that is very likely unknown in the 23rd century. Third it had software that was very likely unknown by the 23rd century. Considering Scotty had to be instructed to use the keyboard, as opposed to voice instructions, how did he know:

-What software to use to do chemical models.
-If such software were even installed.
-Where to even locate the software on the Mac.
-What to do within the chem software.

If the Mac did not have any chem software, he'd probably have to write a program through assembler or other language (I image Mac had a few to choose from back then), meaning he'd need intimate knowledge of both the MacOS and the processor (were they Motorollas back then?)

As an example, I have a decent understanding of UNIX and Windows, I fairly competent in C and pretty good with higher level languages like Perl. Does that mean I could create a punch card program for an old IBM from the 60s/70s. Probably not and that technology's only 30 years old, not 300.

As far as using the keyboard, I'm pretty sure almost anything that's done with a mouse can still be done with the keyboard.

Now stepping out of reality and back into the movie, the scene is still funny and only adds to Scotty's title of "miracle worker".

 

[Timo]

One might assume that this particular machine had this particular type of program installed, and was in fact largely dedicated for the purpose. It was found in the office of a factory employee who apparently was competent in the study, design and manufacture of new materials, after all.

One might also take note of the fact that Macs were leading utilizers of menu-based access, an extremely newbie-friendly interface in general terms. Moreover, those Macs would be facing competition from Henry Starling's machines which, while based on 29th century hardware, probably copied an interface idea or two from that downed time machine as well. For all we know, the Trek 1980s computers were significantly superior to ours in terms of interfaces.

Finally, while Scotty is rightfully considered a miracle worker with his own machinery, he is apparently also proficient in operating alien thingamabobs, such as cloaking devices (although in that case, Starfleet Intelligence or their Romulan contacts might have arranged for him to have an original instructions manual). Certainly our TNG and DS9 heroes have the art of operating alien interfaces down pat. Perhaps there is an Academy course for it? (Or an extension you can buy for your Universal Translator program?)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[jayrath]

How was he able to do it?

He's a MIRACLE WORKER!

 

[A beaker full of death]

Something that got me thinking...

Question for ya: did you think it at all strange when Kirk started talking into his "pager" at the pizza place?

 

[Nebusj]

Finally, while Scotty is rightfully considered a miracle worker with his own machinery, he is apparently also proficient in operating alien thingamabobs, such as cloaking devices (although in that case, Starfleet Intelligence or their Romulan contacts might have arranged for him to have an original instructions manual). Certainly our TNG and DS9 heroes have the art of operating alien interfaces down pat. Perhaps there is an Academy course for it? (Or an extension you can buy for your Universal Translator program?)

And, note, that Scott did start out relatively slow in his keyboard work, and grew faster with his modest bits of practice. This is consistent with just being really quite good at figuring out how to figure the system out. Compared to reading Klingon, a non-Unix-derived operating system is probably easy.

 

[Crewman47]

Something that got me thinking...

Question for ya: did you think it at all strange when Kirk started talking into his "pager" at the pizza place?

Uhh? What does that mean, of course I didn't think it was strange. Why do you ask?

 

[A beaker full of death]

Something that got me thinking...

Question for ya: did you think it at all strange when Kirk started talking into his "pager" at the pizza place?

Uhh? What does that mean, of course I didn't think it was strange. Why do you ask?

Because back then we didn't have celphones. It was meant to be as anachronistic as beaming up. It's totally lost on today's audiences, just like Scotty and the computer.

 

[Elder Knight]

...

Can someone explain how he did what he did with nothing but keystrokes ... ?

I don't believe that Microsoft will certify a Windows program unless all of its mouse-action can be accomplished via the keyboard. Programmers have to respect that requirement, ands so offer keyboard alternatives, perhaps grudgingly.

 

[Elder Knight]

...
As an example, I have a decent understanding of UNIX and Windows, I fairly competent in C and pretty good with higher level languages like Perl. Does that mean I could create a punch card program for an old IBM from the 60s/70s. Probably not and that technology's only 30 years old, not 300.
...

I'm pretty sure that I could sit down at a 30-year old computer console and write a moderately long program in Fortran IV . . . but I'd need help in remembering how the keypunch worked, I'd need help with the specific operating system commands, I'd probably use some Fortran V or Fortran 77 commands that hadn't yet been added to the language ... and I'd reflexively reach for the nonexistant mouse every three seconds. It might be impressive, but not at the level we saw in the movie!

I do know a few people who learned how to use an abacus (godnose why, but they did) who could probably startle thousand-year old folk with their skills if they had the chance.

 

[Maurice]

It was ludicrous even in 1986...don't kid yourselves. I groaned at that in the theater...especially when he hit Enter and it made an Apple ][ booting "beep"!

 

[Timo]

Because back then we didn't have celphones.

But we did!



Timo Saloniemi

 

[cultcross]

Well, you had the very first cell phone commercially available, which came out that year - I don't think it's a patch on the Klingon communicator, which itself these days looks clunky and low tech compared to modern cell phones.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7432915/

 

[mythme]

Something that got me thinking...

Question for ya: did you think it at all strange when Kirk started talking into his "pager" at the pizza place?

The only thing I found strange is that after Gillian orders a large pizza, Kirk orders ANOTHER one! With all those onions, little chance of the Shat getting any make out action that night.

 

[A beaker full of death]

The only thing I found strange is that after Gillian orders a large pizza, Kirk orders ANOTHER one! With all those onions, little chance of the Shat getting any make out action that night.

That was meant to show his unfamiliarity with the times. I guess there's no pizza in our future.

 

[A beaker full of death]

Because back then we didn't have celphones.

But we did!



Timo Saloniemi

The brick had been around for two years and cost about $4,000.
Even the "are you a doctor" comment is probably lost today. Back then only doctors, drug dealers and hookers wore pagers.

 

[mythme]

The only thing I found strange is that after Gillian orders a large pizza, Kirk orders ANOTHER one! With all those onions, little chance of the Shat getting any make out action that night.

That was meant to show his unfamiliarity with the times. I guess there's no pizza in our future.

Tom Paris ate it often on Voyager.

 

[zephramc]

^^^True but Paris had an odd obsession with the 20th century. Kirk, I'm guessing, never really gave a rat's ass about the 20th century other than important historical facts.

Not really sure what Kirk's hobbies were. Scotty buried himself in tech-manuals (and probably drown himself with scotch) during his off hours.