Star Trek's complete idiocy with data backups

[Gary7]

I was watching the Voyager episode "Future's End" where they end up in Earth's past. There were many problems with this episode, but still enjoyable.

First major gaffe... time travel is not the same as distance traveling. So they go back to the 20th century... but that should be in the Delta quadrant, not alpha. Doesn't make sense. If movement like that was possible, you'd not need warp drive any longer. Just pop in any where, any time. Free lunch? Energy required to do this... just incomprehensible.

Second major gaffe... Throwback Starling becomes a super genius with Starfleet technology? Seems pretty lame to me. And, even if he spent decades reverse engineering the timeship database and technology, he's still working with old style PC's from the 1990's. Use those to hack into Voyager's system? Please... that's just ridiculous. Also, Starling figures out the doctor's program so quickly, he can induce simulated pain to him by typing a few quick commands? No. Don't buy it.

Next major gaffe... Starling downloads programs from Voyager "destructively"... deleting them. That's utterly ridiculous. Memory is cheap. They could put a thousand terrabytes on one finger sized memory component. Not only that, memory can be protected and certainly core programs should be part of the "firmware" and not possible to overwrite without a very specific program and authorization. Also, all programs, including the doctor, should be periodically backed up. Star Trek has this terrible habit of considering the doctor's program like a physical manifestation that cannot be copied. It's just ridiculous. And this episode brings this front and center rather painfully.

I can't recall off hand if Enterprise manages data backups better, but if they ever do another Star Trek series, I sure hope they don't repeat these glaring gaffes.

 

[CommanderTrip]

^^It's funny. Especially considering they devoted an entire episode to an alien civilization finding..... a backup copy of the Doctor!..... or to be more succinct, the Emergency Medical Hologram backup module.

And then if I'm not mistaken this fact is again contradicited that very season! After emailing the Doctor to the Alpha Quadrant in "Message in a Bottle", the dynamic duo of Paris and Kim try to make their own copy of the doctor. Hilarity ensues!

 

[F. King Daniel]

I was watching the Voyager episode "Future's End" where they end up in Earth's past. There were many problems with this episode, but still enjoyable.

First major gaffe... time travel is not the same as distance traveling. So they go back to the 20th century... but that should be in the Delta quadrant, not alpha. Doesn't make sense. If movement like that was possible, you'd not need warp drive any longer. Just pop in any where, any time. Free lunch? Energy required to do this... just incomprehensible.

29th century technology, remember? Go back a hundred years and explain modern phones with wifi having real-time discussions with people on the other side of the planet and the reaction would be similar.

By ENT's 31st century they're seamlessly teleporting people and ships through time and space with magical unseen technology.

Second major gaffe... Throwback Starling becomes a super genius with Starfleet technology? Seems pretty lame to me. And, even if he spent decades reverse engineering the timeship database and technology, he's still working with old style PC's from the 1990's. Use those to hack into Voyager's system? Please... that's just ridiculous. Also, Starling figures out the doctor's program so quickly, he can induce simulated pain to him by typing a few quick commands? No. Don't buy it.

We don't know what might still be working on the Aeon, or what similar gizmos he may have been playing with for the past decades.

He's accessing 29th century tech from his '96 PC, probably using some kind of interface/emulator he probably just told the Aeon computer to write and it did.

Next major gaffe... Starling downloads programs from Voyager "destructively"... deleting them. That's utterly ridiculous. Memory is cheap. They could put a thousand terrabytes on one finger sized memory component. Not only that, memory can be protected and certainly core programs should be part of the "firmware" and not possible to overwrite without a very specific program and authorization. Also, all programs, including the doctor, should be periodically backed up. Star Trek has this terrible habit of considering the doctor's program like a physical manifestation that cannot be copied. It's just ridiculous. And this episode brings this front and center rather painfully.

I can't recall off hand if Enterprise manages data backups better, but if they ever do another Star Trek series, I sure hope they don't repeat these glaring gaffes.

This part is true. Remember, these are the people who think one ebook = one tablet.

 

[Sophie74656]

^^It's funny. Especially considering they devoted an entire episode to an alien civilization finding..... a backup copy of the Doctor!..... or to be more succinct, the Emergency Medical Hologram backup module.

And then if I'm not mistaken this fact is again contradicited that very season! After emailing the Doctor to the Alpha Quadrant in "Message in a Bottle", the dynamic duo of Paris and Kim try to make their own copy of the doctor. Hilarity ensues!

Living Whiteness takes place after Message in a Bottle, so it is possible that they created a backup after Message in a Bottle which is what was stolen.

In Future's End they end up by Earth because that is where the rift originated

 

[Prax]

Plus we don't know when the backup module was lost, let alone created. Perhaps the incident in Message in a bottle was a catalyst to begin work creating one, and then by Lifeline, when Janeway ia quick to give in to the Doctor's request, she does so with the knowledge that if the Doc is lost...not all is lost.

As for storage space, I've heard that Trek seems to show a future where digital technology has been somewhat abandoned. I've also heard that today, in the real world, great advances in different analog technologies are being made, in which we could eventually see a reversal.

The Doctor's backup module would have to be a pretty enormous chunk to survive atmospheric entry. The computer cores on Starfleet ships are the size of small office buildings.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I like to think that between episodes they acquired some alien tech which allowed them to make exactly one backup of their holographic doctor (which, because of magical bio-neural something, can't be copypasted), which they immediately lost.

 

[Gary7]

I sort of get it, that a time rift could be non-linear, stretching across distance as well as time. Almost like a wormhole. I can accept that then.

I still can't accept Starling's apparent homeless man to genius bit. Only if he was kind of a Jim Ignatowski (Taxi) who was a genius but then got knocked off the rails (drugs, trauma, what have you). It's too bad we didn't get more of a back story.

It might be possible to swallow that, the idea of non-digital technology... but, Starling's computer were all 1990's PC's running on Linux or Windows. Can't see how that would interface with Voyager's non-digital computer system. Not to mention the fact that in the 24th century, they'd have sophisticated software security that would eliminate the hacking threat.
But data is electronic... programs are electronic code... doesn't matter what incarnation you have (digital or quantum), as it's all stored somewhere. I just don't buy the whole bit of a program so large that it can't be backed up. Just look at the advance of compression algorithms and the expansive curve on memory storage. We have micro SD cards that hold 1TB now! Fingernail size. Can you believe it? In the 24th century, you have to believe they've more than 100 times that capability. Of course, access is key. The card would probably have many more data contact points (rather than a bank of 4 or 6 gold bands) for better throughput.
I think we just have to chalk it up to the writers not being savvy enough on existing computer technology. If they were, they'd find some other plausible premise for the plot devices used in Star Trek where programs are lost or "moved".

 

[Nyotarules]

You find that in Star Trek novels as well; folks walking around with numerous data slates, no concept of the cloud system storing data, lots of PADDS and monitors looking like 1990's computers...Please.

 

[Prax]

We have micro SD cards that hold 1TB now!

WOW! I was at the store the other day and saw a 128GB micro SD. I could really use that in my phone, but it was like $80.

I think we just have to chalk it up to the writers not being savvy enough on existing computer technology. If they were, they'd find some other plausible premise for the plot devices used in Star Trek where programs are lost or "moved".

I think it reasonable to allow the writers a little slack. Future's End was aired on November 6th, 1996. Flash Memory was just being introduced, which STrek did capitalize on with the isolinear chips and rods later being used to store information. I'm sure there are much more egregious or farfetched technical "errors" in the show, and in TNG, DS9, and ENT.

Do you remember in "Past Tense", where the internet is described as having "Channels" owned by Media Moguls. The guy is like "I'm Chris Brinner"
Dax says "Oh, what kind of work do you do?"
Chris says "You don't know?! I'll have to talk to my PR people. Chris Brinner, you know...Net Access channel 90?"
Dax says "Ohhhhh, THAT Chris Brinner"

Also, can you imagine someone saying "Ohhh, THAT Bill Gates!"

With Starling hacking Voyager, we're given the impression that it's the 29th Century computer giving him all these abilities, and that over the past 30 years, he's become very familiar with it. He probably sat on it for a while, then made his move, eventually hiring a scientist to look at it, later hiring teams of experts.

I like the Starling story better than if they had just had the government taking Starlings place, like X-Files type story.

 

[fireproof78]

Next major gaffe... Starling downloads programs from Voyager "destructively"... deleting them. That's utterly ridiculous. Memory is cheap. They could put a thousand terrabytes on one finger sized memory component. Not only that, memory can be protected and certainly core programs should be part of the "firmware" and not possible to overwrite without a very specific program and authorization. Also, all programs, including the doctor, should be periodically backed up. Star Trek has this terrible habit of considering the doctor's program like a physical manifestation that cannot be copied. It's just ridiculous. And this episode brings this front and center rather painfully.

I can't recall off hand if Enterprise manages data backups better, but if they ever do another Star Trek series, I sure hope they don't repeat these glaring gaffes.

Star Trek's data management and computer application feels quite ridiculous. Passwords and security codes are never changed after senior officers are compromised (save rarely) and data apparently can just be removed without any trace or ability to recover it. I'm sorry, I can still recover data from a floppy disk with the right tools.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

WOW! I was at the store the other day and saw a 128GB micro SD. I could really use that in my phone, but it was like $80.

I think it reasonable to allow the writers a little slack. Future's End was aired on November 6th, 1996. Flash Memory was just being introduced, which STrek did capitalize on with the isolinear chips and rods later being used to store information. I'm sure there are much more egregious or farfetched technical "errors" in the show, and in TNG, DS9, and ENT.

Do you remember in "Past Tense", where the internet is described as having "Channels" owned by Media Moguls. The guy is like "I'm Chris Brinner"
Dax says "Oh, what kind of work do you do?"
Chris says "You don't know?! I'll have to talk to my PR people. Chris Brinner, you know...Net Access channel 90?"
Dax says "Ohhhhh, THAT Chris Brinner"

Also, can you imagine someone saying "Ohhh, THAT Bill Gates!"

With Starling hacking Voyager, we're given the impression that it's the 29th Century computer giving him all these abilities, and that over the past 30 years, he's become very familiar with it. He probably sat on it for a while, then made his move, eventually hiring a scientist to look at it, later hiring teams of experts.

I like the Starling story better than if they had just had the government taking Starlings place, like X-Files type story.

The American government getting it would be even worse, especially if they were to put any of the tech into any fighter jets, tanks, ships, etc. At least Starling was going to reverse engineer the 29th century tech for peaceful purposes, even if he was misguided and would have cause the deaths of millions of his fellow human beings in the future.

One thing about the episode that gets me; why the frak is 24th century Earth devoid of all of the cacophony of audio messages as figured out by Janeway? Earth in the 24th century would have all of that same cacophony plus more because most of the communication would be with different planets. In fact, all of the Federation member worlds would would have that, as would Starfleet Command.

 

[Sophie74656]

You find that in Star Trek novels as well; folks walking around with numerous data slates, no concept of the cloud system storing data, lots of PADDS and monitors looking like 1990's computers...Please.

Because it WAS the 90s haha

 

[Nyotarules]

Because it WAS the 90s haha

Not when some of the novels were written. I am reading a Star Trek story published in 2009 and Starfleet uses those bright, yellow plastic cards they showed on 1960's tv show to store and transfer data? lol

 

[Refuge]

Because it WAS the 90s haha

I know like if 24th, or even 21st Century was depicted now, every character would have a slumped neck and an enlarged thumb evolved to swipe. We would never seen any of their faces as their phones would be stuck up their noses. God knows what chips would be implanted and where..

 

[Kor]

I know like if 24th, or even 21st Century was depicted now, every character would have a slumped neck and an enlarged thumb evolved to swipe. We would never seen any of their faces as their phones would be stuck up their noses. God knows what chips would be implanted and where..

I don't think they would depict implanted computer chips as a common thing. Unlike other sci-fi, for the most part Trek has always been rather averse to "Cyberpunk" concepts of arbitrary human enhancement.

Kor

 

[Refuge]

Probably right.. my mind is sluggish today but wasn't there an episode on Voyager where someone had a temporary chip somewhere? Bugging or something? I need to do some hunting.

Be a great way to identify everyone. Tuvok could have one in his ear like my cat.

 

[Refuge]

Just to add there is a cute little foil Star Trek has used for ears. It's the ole dropped receiver or com badge routine. You know the one. "Energize". " Oh where's Commander Chakotay?" Flash to a scene of his com badge lying in the dirt. A chip to lock onto would be too easy.

 

[CommanderTrip]

In the end, I can overlook Trek's inconsistency with data storage and management. The doctor's episodes were some of the most entertaining for me. Same for one the computer breaks down/gets hacked/gets stolen/gets invaded by an alien entity. However, one thing I really just can't forgive is Captain's Picard's inability to destroy the Enterprise E in "Nemesis"

Computer: Auto Destruct is offline.

Oh. Didn't know that the self destruct button could break. That must make for some awkward follow up orders.. I would hope someone takes the initiative and runs down to engineering with a phaser and initiates the self destruct sequence the old fashion way.

 

[Prax]

In the end, I can overlook Trek's inconsistency with data storage and management. The doctor's episodes were some of the most entertaining for me. Same for one the computer breaks down/gets hacked/gets stolen/gets invaded by an alien entity. However, one thing I really just can't forgive is Captain's Picard's inability to destroy the Enterprise E in "Nemesis"

Computer: Auto Destruct is offline.

Oh. Didn't know that the self destruct button could break. That must make for some awkward follow up orders.. I would hope someone takes the initiative and runs down to engineering with a phaser and initiates the self destruct sequence the old fashion way.

You'd think so. Isn't it just a warp cor breach? If so, warp core breaches seem like the easiest thing in the world to happen.

 

[SPCTRE]

It's the ole dropped receiver or com badge routine. You know the one. "Energize". " Oh where's Commander Chakotay?" Flash to a scene of his com badge lying in the dirt. A chip to lock onto would be too easy.

the inconsistencies re: the capabilities of interior sensors varying wildly can be maddening, yeah