So I got a question...who did Sarah Silverman hook up with?

[Phaser Two]

So for anyone just dying to know the answer, Silverman finally clarified it in an interview with Seth Meyers.

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7m19s, in case the link doesn't jump straight to it as it's supposed to.

Thanks, Tosk. For anyone who couldn't get the link to work, Silverman points to a still from the episode showing her with Robbie McNeill and Tim Russ. She then claims that she both (1) kissed McNeill on the show and (2) "made out with him," indicating Russ, offscreen. She also notes that they had McNeill "standing on an apple box [for their scenes together], because God forbid they portray a woman's true height." (These are not 100% verbatim quotes because I can't be arsed right now to transcribe it exactly, but I didn't change her clear meaning.)

This is all either a knowing gag (to which the Voyager actors probably acceded, either then or years later) or she's just making stuff up to be shocking and not really being particularly cool about it. Tim Russ was, I believe, married during the show's run. And Robbie McNeill was between 6-0 and 6-1 during Voyager's filming, while Silverman is 5-6. Not exactly an "apple box" situation even if she had on four-inch heels.

 

[at Quark's]

Maybe they should have had Rain Robinson fall in love with Harry instead?

Somehow, I have the feeling that had that happened, she'd be counted today as one of Harry's unlucky love interests, whereas now, she's remembered as one of the ladies that was impressed by Tom. (it's interesting how things get interpreted differently based on the main cast character/)

 

[Lynx]

Somehow, I have the feeling that had that happened, she'd be counted today as one of Harry's unlucky love interests, whereas now, she's remembered as one of the ladies that was impressed by Tom. (it's interesting how things get interpreted differently based on the main cast character/)

You do have a point here.

 

[Oddish]

This is all either a knowing gag (to which the Voyager actors probably acceded, either then or years later) or she's just making stuff up to be shocking and not really being particularly cool about it. Tim Russ was, I believe, married during the show's run. And Robbie McNeill was between 6-0 and 6-1 during Voyager's filming, while Silverman is 5-6. Not exactly an "apple box" situation even if she had on four-inch heels.

I have serious doubts about Russ. Tim Russ was approached with the idea of a Tuvok romance, and he reportedly said "I don't cheat on my wife, and neither does Tuvok". And I don't see putting a man my height on an apple box to make him appear taller.

Somehow, I have the feeling that had that happened, she'd be counted today as one of Harry's unlucky love interests, whereas now, she's remembered as one of the ladies that was impressed by Tom. (it's interesting how things get interpreted differently based on the main cast character/)

That's a symptom of the showrunners' fixation with making Harry appear to be as hapless as possible. Consider Harry's dubious list of romances...
- A girlfriend half a zettameter away. And considering that upon being reunited with her, he spent the whole ing episode trying to get back... couldn't have been much of a relationship.
- The Delaney sister who's not into him.
- A bunch of life sucking alien vvampires women.
- A three-year-old Ocampa who never existed.
- A hologram who's not really a hologram, who dumps him for Tuvok.
- A hologram who is a hologram, who turns into a cow.
- A Klingon who wants to jump his bones, fortunately Neelix rescues him.
- A zombie ex-ensign turned Kobali.
- An alien terrorist.
- Seven, but with little success.
- A woman who causes him to glow in the dark, and gets him a reprimand that probably finishes off his already ruined career.

 

[Jedman67]

- A hologram who is a hologram, who turns into a cow.

 

[Oddish]

You can start "Spirit Folk" at 11:49:35 on 12/31. Harry will kiss the cow at exactly midnight.
Not sure if that's skipping the opening credits or watching them.

EDIT: I just realized, that's ten disastrous romances for Harry. We could do a Top 10 list.

 

[Jedman67]

You can start "Spirit Folk" at 11:49:35 on 12/31. Harry will kiss the cow at exactly midnight.
Not sure if that's skipping the opening credits or watching them.

EDIT: I just realized, that's ten disastrous romances for Harry. We could do a Top 10 list.

I"ll be asleep then. But Harry kissing a cow will never not be funny

 

[ED-209]

The character had a threesome with Paris & Tuvok.

 

[Ragitsu]

The character had a threesome with Paris & Tuvok.

Director's cut of the uncut?

 

[at Quark's]

That's a symptom of the showrunners' fixation with making Harry appear to be as hapless as possible.

Even reconstructions of Harry Kim were portrayed as wimps. EvilKim in Living Witness ('I can keep this up all day!' <hitting prisoner> 'Maybe I can't keep this up all day!') and HypochondriacKim , sorry, Kymble, (in Author, Author) ('There must be millions of viruses in this quadrant that no one's ever encountered before. With my luck, l'll probably end up catching half of them!') (Granted, all crewmember reconstructions were made ridiculous in some way in that ep).

 

[Oddish]

And he's up to 11 disastrous romances now, because I forgot about Linnis. I don't think any character matches that number.

 

[Tosk]

And he's up to 11 disastrous romances now, because I forgot about Linnis. I don't think any character matches that number.

Depends on your criteria...Kirk had more "romances" than that, and none of them were happily ever after.

 

[Phaser Two]

Depends on your criteria...Kirk had more "romances" than that, and none of them were happily ever after.

No, and of course he had many fewer than legend has it. Shoot, his romance count and Harry's aren't really too far off . . . .

 

[Tosk]

he had many fewer than legend has it

Definitely. But his numbers are still pretty high. Memory Alpha's subsection on his romances has twenty-four names in it.

 

[Phaser Two]

Definitely. But his numbers are still pretty high. Memory Alpha's subsection on his romances has twenty-four names in it.

Yeah, but without even looking I know they're almost certainly counting Sylvia from "Catspaw," Areel Shaw, and (an effectively holographic) Ruth. And several others that don't match the narrative.

 

[Tosk]

I'll grant you Sylvia (and there's a few others I'd personally strike off the list), but the other two were real relationships in Kirk's past.

Edit: Looking at the list closer, there are definitely a bunch that shouldn't count for all kinds of reasons. Like La'an, Rand (it's quite gross that she's on the list), Miri, Marlena, and a bunch of faked/forced seductions.

My count from that list of real relationships would be only about twelve, give or take. So I concede, while still maintaining that Kirk just might have Harry beat. (Does Harry really have eleven? Citation needed.)

 

[Oddish]

Does Harry really have eleven? Citation needed.)

Scroll up. I cited them on this very page.

 

[Tosk]

Scroll up. I cited them on this very page.

Just as we struck several from Kirk's...Harry being interested in someone doesn't really count.

(They do count as evidence when trying to paint him as a hapless loser, but not as romances.)

 

[Phaser Two]

I'll grant you Sylvia (and there's a few others I'd personally strike off the list), but the other two were real relationships in Kirk's past.

Edit: Looking at the list closer, there are definitely a bunch that shouldn't count for all kinds of reasons. Like La'an, Rand (it's quite gross that she's on the list), Miri, Marlena, and a bunch of faked/forced seductions.

My count from that list of real relationships would be only about twelve, give or take. So I concede, while still maintaining that Kirk just might have Harry beat. (Does Harry really have eleven? Citation needed.)

I was striking Areel and Ruth because they didn't occur on the show, which is the usual tiresome attack against Kirk - that he was always getting involved. Shaw and JTK did have the "lowly lieutenant" kiss on the bridge, but that's not much. And he and the Ruth android didn't get within about 100 yards of each other IIRC - that we saw.

Where is this list? Having Miri on there is frankly despicable. Rand too, as you say, but at least she was of age, and I'm not allowing for Miri's actual chronological age of 250-300 or whatever it was. I would count Marlena Moreau, actually. Honestly, the faked/forced seductions, as you nicely put it, comprise the vast majority of the Kirk love interests seen on-screen - Drusilla, Deela, Odona, Kalinda, Lenore Karidian, Elaan. The rest are mostly figures from his past, which negates the accusatory nature of the trope.

My list would be Deela, Odona (I'm counting them both because I think it was clear from the script and Shatner's acting choices that Kirk had genuine feelings for each of them), Miramanee obviously, Marlena Moreau, and the other obvious ones - Edith Keeler and Rayna Kapec. I'll add in Shahna for the same reasons as Deela and Odona.

That's seven. Again, I'm not counting any romance that wasn't seen on TOS as currently in progress, because my point is in part that the "JTK was always sleeping with women on Star Trek" trope is stupid and that Harry Kim actually had more romances. And counting Deela, Odona, Shahna and Marlena Moreau isn't really required either, so it could be argued that the actual number of seen-in-progress Kirk romances is four. Of course, TOS had 79 episodes for Kirk to seek out new life and new civilizations while Voyager had 172 episodes for Harry to do the same, but regardless, the derisive anti-Kirk trope really needs to die already.

 

[Tosk]

my point is in part that the "JTK was always sleeping with women on Star Trek" trope is stupid

I was not intentionally quoting that trope. I agree with you about it. (And I regret referring to MA's list before actually reading it in detail.)

and that Harry Kim actually had more romances

But did he? Some of the ones listed above are just Harry being into someone and them not. That ain't no romance.

Perhaps the problem lies in a difference of opinion as to what constitutes a romance?