• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

M.S.A. (Mary Sues/Marty Stus Anonymous)

There was something written once, I think as a joke... and i think here recently... that suggested that weasly crusher was GR's M.Sue-esque character. Sorry, minds to fuzzy right now for more details about it.
 
Da'an said:
The First and Original Mary Sue:

A Trekkie's Tale by Paula Smith.
Click to expand...

Holy crap, I used to HAVE that issue of Menagerie. I bought it at the 1974 international Star Trek Con in New York!

For the record, the story was written tongue in cheek *because* there was an extant "Mary Sue" *type* of story common in fandom -- it just didn't have a name, but everyone knew of those stories.
 
I had one, but she was for another fandom. I still whip her out on occasion when I need a handy omnipotent being, but she's definitely not... so nice anymore.
 
Huh. Some of those boxes are weighted much more heavily than others.

For my OCC main character, Dawud Jaffar, I checked the following seven boxes:

--Character's name is "Your name, variation of your name, nickname, or any name that has been applied to you?" ("Dawud" is Arabic for "David," my first name)
--Character becomes a "genetically, scientifically, cybernetically, or magically altered/enhanced being, possibly with new powers?" (Jaffar has an artificial body cavity in his abdomen, useful for concealing small items)
--Does your character have a side that tends to get him/her in trouble with authority on a semi-regular basis? (Yes--that's why he's in prison)
--How many languages does your character fluently speak? (Two--Minaretian Arabic and Federation Standard)
-- Does your character frequently carry knives, daggers, or other little sharp pointy objects concealed within his/her clothing for no other reason than that they might be come in handy? (Yes, a shank)
--Is your character ever spared by a villain? (A couple of times--though not lately)
--If your character had a bad past with his/her parents, does he/she reconcile with them at any point?(Yes--reconciled with his father, right before his father's death)

...and I scored 19 points! "Probably not a Mary-Sue, although a character can go either way at this point. Fanfiction writers should pay attention to ensure that their characters aren't getting too Sue-ish." :(
 
My character, Henry Kano, scored a 20 on that same test. Just gotta be careful with writing him I suppose.
 
Just remember, the test results aren't necessarily the most important thing. It's how your character is actually written and received that makes the difference.
 
You know, going over that test I realize how many "real" characters would qualify as an MS. True, the argument is that if the character was on TV, in the films, or in the novels it doesn't count, but if you look at some of the questions, you realize that characters such as Edward Jellico, Mackenzie Calhoun, or even the more recent Sonek Pran might be described as an MS. The difference, I think, between a good character and an MS is good writing; if it's an interesting character, then it shouldn't matter.
 
^ Oh, agreed, entirely.

I'd much rather read about an entertaining and well written MS than some ill conceived and presented original character.
 
Nerys Ghemor said:
CeJay said:
Time to out myself. I've written a character which has been accused of being a Mary Sue.

And after researching that a bit I can see why.

Her people are described as being ethereally beautiful and live on a world that knows neither war nor violence. They also mature faster intellectually which means she is just about 21 but as smart as a woman twice her age and her people possess a scientifically unexplainable 'aura' which affects most people around them albeit it does not make them wanna have sex with her like for example Deltans and Orions.

She has a short appearance in the short story The Sins Of The Father but is heavily featured in my novels where she has been known to make a roguish trader give up secret information by utilizing her 'skills' and settle down an angry starship captain by offering nothing more than a smile before meeting her CO.

That doesn't sound good, come to think of it but I maintain she isn't a complete Mary Sue. I have to. What else can I do? I've come to like the character too much to write her out ...
Click to expand...

Has she ever felt ANY conflict about the morality (or possible inherent lack thereof) of using these characteristics? Has she ever been confronted with it in a way that would make a serious impact on her? One would think, for instance, that in the wake of the Borg incursions, that the abrogation of the will in ANY form would be viewed as a serious crime or at least morally very troubling. Hell, if you ask me, someone who has that much undue influence on others who cannot fight that influence, and there is no way to control it like the pheromone suppressants that Orions and Deltans take, there is an argument to be made that she should not even be serving in Starfleet where she might cloud the judgment of others around her.

What about her flaws? Have you given her any? Does she have conflicts with anybody? What about her people? Surely there is a dark side to how they became the way they are. Is there some way in which that might bite her--or them--in the ass?

This is just some food for thought...examples of some of the things I have not seen, that cause me to have problems with Deen and the Tenarian people as a whole.
Click to expand...

Those are some great ideas.

I've already decided that I want to take this character to some darker and more morally muddling places in stories to come.

And I might even revisit some of your suggestions.
 
CeJay said:
Those are some great ideas.

I've already decided that I want to take this character to some darker and more morally muddling places in stories to come.

And I might even revisit some of your suggestions.
Click to expand...

Just be careful not to take it too far. You might back inadvertently into Anti-Sue or Angsty-Sue territory.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_sue#.22Angsty.22_Sue

Still, a discussion of the morality of her abilities would fit into the Trek style. There's the potential here for some interesting writing.

Good luck!
 
I about died laughing from this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_sue#Canon_Sue_.28in_original_source.29
Canon Sue (in original source)

A "canon Sue" may also refer to a character whose canon portrayal itself is seen as a "Mary Sue", rather than a character who has been altered in fan fiction. Typically, this refers to a character accused of being overly idealized or having other traits traditionally associated with fan fiction "Mary Sues", such as being "special" by having a gratuitously tragic past, unrealistic skills, or a seeming inability for the character to do wrong. Examples include Wesley Crusher[2] and Amanda Rogers[2] in Star Trek: The Next Generation.
Click to expand...
 
When I first started writing TNG fanfic at age 15, I created the most horrible, masturbatory Mary Sue character ever. He was like a Super Wesley Crusher: an extraordinary genius who graduated Starfleet Academy at age 15 and assigned to bridge duty on the Enterprise. Even worse, his name was David (my real first name) Kirk. Yeah, he was Captain Kirk's grandson. In his first day on board, he managed to save the ship from a Romulan spy and win the affection of a hot blonde chick that worked in Engineering. (Incidentally, Hot Blonde was based on an attractive girl on our school's tennis team)

But that was nothing compared to to the follow-up story, in which a "dimensional wormhole" connected the TNG, Star Wars, and TNG Mirror universes. When this wormhole opened, a runabout piloted by young Ensign Kirk was magically transported to Dagobah, where Ensign Mary Sue learned he had latent Jedi powers and was given a lightsaber by Yoda. Meanwhile, Darth Vader's Star Destroyer came through the wormhole and encountered the Enterprise. For some stupid-ass reason that I can't remember, Darth Vader kidnapped Ensign Kirk's girlfriend (the hot blonde from the last story) and held her in his detention block. He then reveals that he's been in contact with the Mirror Universe, and has trained the Mirror Ensign Kirk in the ways of the Force, which turned him into a Super Mega Badass who took command of the Mirror Enterprise and took the Mirror Hot Blonde chick to be his slutty girlfriend.

Just in the nick of time, the real Ensign Kirk returns and rescues Hot Blonde from Darth Vader after a lightsaber fight with his black-cape-wearing Mirror Universe double. When the Star Destroyers retreat through the wormhole, Ensign Kirk follows in his runabout and seals the wormhole behind him, heroically trapping himself in the Star Wars universe to keep the Star Trek universe safe from the threat of invasion by the Empire. Yoda sends him on a mission to track down and kill a bunch of Dark Jedi, and after he does so, Yoda uses the Force to transport him back to the Star Trek universe. Upon his return to the Enterprise, Captain Picard promotes him to Lieutenant, on account of his super badass awesomeness, and he gets engaged to Hot Blonde.

Another story that I started to write, but never finished, had Ensign Kirk being sent back in time to the 1990s and meeting up with an ancestress of Hot Blonde. He also fought with Data's brother Lore.

I don't have any of these stories anymore; they were written in notebooks that were filled up and thrown away ages ago, but I firmly believe that they are among the worst fiction ever written in the history of the universe. They were as outrageous as MadBaggins' "Hot Cousin Saga", but with none of the entertainment value.
 
G. Kirk: *lmao* Dave, You've gotta be kidding me? I used to read some stuff like that, back when Paramount was wiping-out Tripod & Geocities home-made fic sites with material like that before the "Fair Use" clauses came into effect & Paramount-Viacom suddenly realized the fic-writers (fans) were keeping Trek alive for future generations of book-buyers / movie-go'ers / merchandise purchasers.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top