The bogus "deadbeat dad" narrative just would not stop.
DC Cinematic Universe ( The James Gunn era)
- Thread starter Samurai8472
- Start date
What's interesting is that for the most part, Snyder's version of Superman became a creative cul de sac, contributing nothing lasting to the general Superman lore than perhaps a few bits of continuity.* It didn't reshape or inspire the comic book writers or artists for very long, if at all.
Miller's take on Batman in the Dark Knight books and Year One arguably changed the way the character is seen. Not so with Man of Steel.
John Byrne has said that the Christopher Reeves movies inspired some of his choices in rebooting the characters and continuity in 1986, specifically making the romance between Lois and Clark more central to the narrative and taking inspiration from Margot Kidder's portrayal.**
Supes in the comics - and merchandising - today is as colorful and bright a character as he ever was, portrayed as even more friendly, open, empathetic and protective than a generation ago, treating everyone else as an equal and taking inspiration from his fellows.
Snyder's take on him as a brooding, uncertain, aloof god-like figure has been rejected by other creators and the fanbase as a kind of invasive foreign object.
Well, okay, his asthetics probably did account for the color palette on the CW version of Superman's outfit.
*Do they use the "emblem means hope" in the comics? I'll bet they do.
**Honestly, I've never seen the Kidder stuff in Byrne's Lois. But that's what Byrne said.
In the comics Superman's emblem has apparently been the Kryptonian symbol of hope since 2004. It was also revealed to represent the House of El, which something the 1978 movie came up with first.
Doesn't Lois Lane being a poor speller come from Kidder's Lois? The look of the Fortress even today comes from that movie, but I'm not sure if Byrne introduced that.
Mark Waid introduced that in Superman: Birthright. In that story, the symbol is not actually the crest of the House of El, but is worn by most Kryptonian people.
There was no Fortress of Solitude during Byrne's run. It was re-introduced shortly after Byrne left.
Hmm, one thing from the DCEU Superman that may have had lasting influence was casting a black actor as Perry White, something that both My Adventures with Superman and the upcoming Gunn film have emulated. Adventures' bearded Jor-El may owe something to Russell Crowe as well, I suppose.
Also I agree that it affected Superman and Lois's subdued and solemn tone and desaturated color palette, though I wish it hadn't.
In the Arrowverse Supergirl, the symbol was called the El Mayarah, for the Kryptonese phrase meaning "Stronger together." As such, it was also the House of El's crest. But I suppose it's possible that "Stronger together" and "hope" could be synonymous or related in Kryptonese, if the culture sees hope as something one draws from others.
Perhaps true, but there’s more heart and humanity in any given ten minutes of S&L than in Snyder’s entire ten hours of DCEU output.
Heck, there was more heart and humanity in the first four minutes of S&L, than in all of Snyder's DC output.
The smile is what sells it.
The first three minutes of the first ep of S&L gave me more of what I wanted than Snyder's DC oeuvre.
Edit: Pipped by Darren, and his timing was more accurate than mine.
According to...?
"Not good" at this stage is leaning toward a potential disaster.
I agree, but that's all the more reason that the sullen Snyderesque elements felt like a poor fit for the show. Not just the dull colors, but did we have to get two "Death of Superman" riffs in the course of four seasons? Not to mention the jarring tonal incongruity of portraying the Silver Agey nonsense of a cube-shaped Bizarro Earth yet playing it as gravely serious dystopian drama.
I’ve said a number of times that, in theory, Superman & Lois isn’t the Super-show I would have made. I default to lighter and funnier and more colorful for this stuff. But in execution, that reveals the limits of my creative imagination, because S&L turned out to be superb. Yes, I still might have preferred a little more visual pop (the dirty-looking Supersuit was always a drag), and maybe a few more laughs, but it feels churlish to carp about what are ultimately minor concerns in the face of how rich, emotional, human, and humane the series turned out to be. In the end, there’s very little I would change, because I wouldn’t want Superman & Lois to be anything other than its own unique and unforgettable self.
(And I got a big kick out of the cube-shaped Bizarro Earth.)
(And I got a big kick out of the cube-shaped Bizarro Earth.)
Maybe the cube shaped Bizarro Earth was just a reminder from producers to not take this stuff too seriously?
I really struggle to understand the complaint.
Ironically, all of the great material from Superman and Lois had little to do with that series' version of the Superman character, which was its weakest element.
I thought its first season and most of its third (except the Luthor parts) were superb, but season 2 was terrible, and season 4 was superb in some ways and terrible in others. It's probably the most uneven series in the Arrowverse. And yes, even at its best, it was definitely not the Hoechlin/Tulloch Superman show I wanted to see.
Nope.
How much of that Un-Even-ness was caused by COVID & it's shooting schedule?
Season 2 was the series’ weakest. Ally Allston was underconceived as a character, and a lot of the conceptual stuff like the pendants was rather muddled. But there was still much to enjoy, and the fantastic third and fourth seasons removed any lingering disappointment from the second for me.
I’m rewatching the final season currently, after it was released on Blu-ray last week. I’m four episodes in at this point, and it’s still as great as I remembered. And the best (“When the Lights Come On,” “A Regular Guy,” “It Went By So Fast”) is yet to come.
I’m rewatching the final season currently, after it was released on Blu-ray last week. I’m four episodes in at this point, and it’s still as great as I remembered. And the best (“When the Lights Come On,” “A Regular Guy,” “It Went By So Fast”) is yet to come.
Nope right back at ya the S&L version of the title character was poorly conceived. Not at all what a live action Superman should be. On the other hand, S&Ls Clark turned out to be one of the best of the adapted versions.
Okay, I’ll play, since I’m a little intrigued at your praise for the show’s Clark as opposed to its Superman. What exactly is your beef with the latter?
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