• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Data: the kinder, gentler A.I.

I disagree with the claim that all characters who are more logical than emotional represent autism, but that's a separate topic.

The EMH can be backed up in one episode, and never in any other episodes. In general, he can't be backed up. Living Witness just chose to ignore that for the sake of the story.

When we get descriptions of how Data's brain worked it seemed comparable to neurons growing new dendrites. It's true we never see any explanation of the limits for how Data can reprogram himself. Maybe he can reprogram his behavior but can't reprogram the core algorithms that drive his values. Which Dr Soong might have done to make them like humans, we can learn new skills but we can't reprogram our basic drives.
 
To use an analogy for why I call it magic, it's the programing equivalent of replacing a humans brain and having them magically stay the exact same person they were before the replacement.
And I don't really have a problem with you calling it "magic" necessarily. It's just that this "magic" may indeed be possible at some (probably distant) point in the future.
 
Only pockets within starfleet knew of Control, the rest live in blissful ignorance.

One example is Daystrom, who developed the M5 system, uncomfortably so soon after Control was apparently defeated.

I wouldn't put it past the M5 to have developed the same grand ambitions as Control did had it not encountered Kirk...
 
Do you see the possibility for scaling back technology to be a realistic scenario in our day? Google Glass is one example of a technology that was developed, worn, thrown on the ground and stomped on repeatedly. What do we see as those boundaries, and what tech do you foresee in the distant future that Discovery seems to be headed into?
Somewhat. You cannot uninvent a thing but you can make something that works but isn't practicable.

No one has walked on the moon since the early 1970s. and they may not this decade, either. No one forgot HOW to build rockets and trans-lunar injection burns and everything else you need to get there. It's just too expensive and no one has needed/wanted to enough to make it happen again.

Giant VTOL passenger traffic. The Empire State Building was in part conceived as an airship port. You could get on your flight across the world right there, theoretically. They don't do that anymore. The last flights out of downtown New York on a vertical take off vehicle occurred via Chinook type helicopters off the old PanAm building. No more passenger airships, no more PanAm, no more flying coach from skycrapers. They don't do that anymore.

The electric car was almost given up on when the design outnumbered gasoline and steam cars in the early 1900's. It's back now, though.

Atomic Weapons: This is 1940's technology. It was developed at the same time as liquid fueled rockets and jet engines. There isn't anything stopping all but the poorest countries from throwing everything they have into obtaining or making these weapons, but the nuclear club remains small and has in fact shrunk a little. It's not a technological reason but a political one. For the most part, the human race would like to see them all gone. I hope.

Undersea Colonies: There's a NASA habitat, off the keys, a hotel off the keys where you can spend the night and have pizza delivered, and there's that new restaurant in Sweden. 3. That's it. There used to be more people (not counting military submarines) living and working in scientific undersea laboratories than now. There used to be dreams of undersea colonies. but it hasn't happened, and it looks more and more like it may never. No one forgot how. They just don't.

Seasteading: along with the last bit, just to make Nemo cry more, the idea of seasteading while perfectly technologically possible, simply hasn't suceeded. The most recent attempt at sea steading has two people on the run from Thai authorities with a possible death sentence on the line. That, plus the strange tale of the Republic of Minerva, isn't going to make anyone who can make this happen, enervated to do so any time soon.

Vaccinations: all but the most complete extremist idiotic fringe used to make sure their kids got shots, and diseases were wiped out. Now there are more extremists and the idiot fringe looks more like a blanket.

(was going to add greening the desert, etc, but the more i wrote the more depressing it is. i think we may be on the cusp of a new dark age, if we don't fight it like mad now)
 
I disagree with the claim that all characters who are more logical than emotional represent autism
They represent a stereotype of autism. Odo is actually the closest to my own personal experience as someone who is autistic--complete with the occasional emotional meltdowns.
It's just too expensive and no one has needed/wanted to enough to make it happen again.
It's not "too expensive". There's just not enough political will to do so. That's why private industry is most likely the way we'll go back to the Moon at all.
 
They represent a stereotype of autism.

I agree there are parallels of experience, but I think it’s worth drawing a distinction between those who are predisposed to logic by their neurological wiring and those by their personality and preference. For example, Spock can process emotional nuances very well and has a personal belief that they lead to poor decisions, whereas Data has trouble processing them.

In short, I think it’s reductionist to ascribe a complex behavioral pattern to a single root cause.
 
It's not "too expensive". There's just not enough political will to do so. That's why private industry is most likely the way we'll go back to the Moon at all.
I think we're at the same point but splitting hairs. There is little will. and it is damned expensive.
Find the customers who've been paying to go since 71.
ESA and Japan both had at least the will to have crewed space vehicles, the Hermes and the Hope shuttle. Both programs are long dead. There was clearly will, and both nations have the know-how, but that will rises in proportion to how low the price is. The Russians turned their attention to space stations and duration flights. China's crewed space program is doing.. whatever it's doing at its very relaxed pace, but at least they have the capability, which since 2011 is better than the United States can claim (speaking of things invented but no longer done).

I very much advocate settling the moon as part of a broader move into the solar system. I'm not a Zubrin Mars Nut. Private industry has shown no interest in going to the moon though, so far because there's no economic case for it. Yes He3, rocket fuel, glass, etc, but none of that has panned out yet. I think, personally, that it will but i also suspect Government is going to have to be the bootstrapper for that to happen. I could discuss my thoughts on that ad nauseum but this probably wouldn't be the right thread for it.

The fact remains, no one HAS gone to the moon in decades. Going to the moon is extremely expensive, and in fact until we have three things: private spacecraft capable of going to, and returning from the moon, private lander that can at least perform as well as the LEM, and a HLV or fuel depot multiple launch system that will get materials and people to and from the moon, it isn't going to happen. We're closer than we were but the recent loss of a Dragon under testing, the landing gear failure on DreamChaser a few years ago, and all the setbacks Starliner has had shows we are not there. Falcon Heavy, with multiple launches could get it done, but its only just now become a vehicle that's flown a paying customer.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top