I was thinking about Starfleet and their Galaxy Class, and a comparison made online between it and the Nimitz class. Is the Galaxy class undercrewed? There are two to six times as many on the Nimitz as the Galaxy. Is it that automated in the future, or would it be more realistic to have a larger crew? Maybe 2000 or so?
Crew sizes and bunking
- Thread starter JJohnson
- Start date
Why would the enterprise be undercrewed? It can even be run with far less people and all the extra space on the ent-D can be explained, as the following fragment shows 
-Remember Me.
-Remember Me.
Automation does most of it, for sure. We've been seeing that throughout the whole 21st century, and the computers and systems of the 24th blow anything we have out of the water. Engineers should be the biggest department, followed by 'deck' -command, security - and then 'Stewards' - medical, science. 1000 people honestly feels a little high to me at times, but it does include security personnel, specialized scientists and their teams, and crew amenity personnel.
An argument can surely be made that it could hold even 5,000 crew - cadets, trainees, more scientists, more security, diplomats, so on and so on, but should be under a commodore then or so.
While I can see the point about automation being more advanced and thus needing fewer crew for the 24th century, the fact is this... space is dangerous.
Putting aside hostile alien attacks, you have spatial rifts, anomalies, scientific missions gone wrong, etc. You'll still need a good amount of crew for repairs and maintenance.
I do agree that engineering should be the biggest staffed department on the ship, a fact we can see VOYAGER take to heart. (There were far more gold uniforms than blue, even in the background. Red outnumbered blue by a lot, too. And while many gold ones on the ship were security, a vast majority of former Maquis, were in engineering. Seska, Chell, Dalby, Bendera, Hogan, Jonas, Tabor, and of course Torres.)
I have always felt that "The Arsenal of Freedom" was what made Picard decide to make Geordi his permanent chief engineer. Engineering is arguably the most important department on a starship, and Picard needed someone solid to run it. Geordi's cool head and analytical problem solving of the Minos situation were definite points in his favor and why he made a good chief engineer.
Putting aside hostile alien attacks, you have spatial rifts, anomalies, scientific missions gone wrong, etc. You'll still need a good amount of crew for repairs and maintenance.
I do agree that engineering should be the biggest staffed department on the ship, a fact we can see VOYAGER take to heart. (There were far more gold uniforms than blue, even in the background. Red outnumbered blue by a lot, too. And while many gold ones on the ship were security, a vast majority of former Maquis, were in engineering. Seska, Chell, Dalby, Bendera, Hogan, Jonas, Tabor, and of course Torres.)
I have always felt that "The Arsenal of Freedom" was what made Picard decide to make Geordi his permanent chief engineer. Engineering is arguably the most important department on a starship, and Picard needed someone solid to run it. Geordi's cool head and analytical problem solving of the Minos situation were definite points in his favor and why he made a good chief engineer.
For story purposes, other than the main seven and a few supporting characters it doesn't matter to me how big the crew is because we never spent time with any of them. It's like people saying Sickbay is too small. Sure but for the show it works fine. A few more randos taking up space isn't going to make a scene between Beverly and Picard work any better.
On the other hand, my thought goes to that there are three shifts running over the day and how many people is it per shift and is it actually something like a third of the entire crew really only active at one time. And if the blueprints say the ship is too empty, just make some new blueprints and chuck some more cargo bays or a forest or something inside. Maybe there's a shopping mall that takes up several decks.
On the other hand, my thought goes to that there are three shifts running over the day and how many people is it per shift and is it actually something like a third of the entire crew really only active at one time. And if the blueprints say the ship is too empty, just make some new blueprints and chuck some more cargo bays or a forest or something inside. Maybe there's a shopping mall that takes up several decks.
Well according to those blue prints that were released (ymmv whether you want to accept them or not) a lot of space is taken up by that "mall" area where the civilians and off-duty crew are supposed to spend their days. Then there might be a cetacean ops which probably takes up quite a bit of space (though I find that one hard to reconcile with the show)
The sick bay we see is supposedly only a small portion of a much larger medical facility, and the same must be true for that "arboretum" we see. There also have to be more lounges than just Ten Forward.
There's also the many facilities (including a pool) Wesley mentions in the pilot, there's schools, daycares, all sorts of things. Cargo holds, I think here's two shuttle bays...
Plus as mentioned, they have to keep some space aside for emergencies.
The Galaxy class is also supposed to be designed for a reasonably comfortable habitation. And really, why wouldn't that be the case considering they spend years on end on that ship?
I suppose lower, unmarried level crew have room mates to give them an incentive to do their best to rank up and have their own living space.
The sick bay we see is supposedly only a small portion of a much larger medical facility, and the same must be true for that "arboretum" we see. There also have to be more lounges than just Ten Forward.
There's also the many facilities (including a pool) Wesley mentions in the pilot, there's schools, daycares, all sorts of things. Cargo holds, I think here's two shuttle bays...
Plus as mentioned, they have to keep some space aside for emergencies.
The Galaxy class is also supposed to be designed for a reasonably comfortable habitation. And really, why wouldn't that be the case considering they spend years on end on that ship?
I suppose lower, unmarried level crew have room mates to give them an incentive to do their best to rank up and have their own living space.
There are 3 shuttlebays... two in the drive section, and the a much larger one in the saucer. We really only see that one open once in "Cause And Effect", and not even for its main purpose.
I done some maths. You could put all 1012 people on deck 10, and they would have over 1500 sqft each. Just 1 deck.
It is huge.
It is huge.
I got so much of a kick out of the Enterprise-D tour, especially starting in Main Shuttlebay. It's cemented the idea in my head that's where I'd want to work if I was in Star Trek.
I commented on this in the Badly Designed thread, saying, "really think a crew of 3000, plus a smattering of civilians, would make more sense. The ship is huge; and having it run by 200-300 people at any given time doesn't seem sufficient given all the things that need to be done -- operations, maintenance, research, various support missions in local systems, continuing education, weekends/days off (I know ship duty is usually 7 days, but this is a multi-year journey), and the list goes on."
To the point about automation and computers... One of the novels -- I forget which one off hand -- addressed this, and I really love the line of thinking. Lt Uhura was having a conversation with some starbase doctor who was being a bit of a snob regarding the Enterprise's low-tech setup with physical switches, wires, and circuit boards in Sickbay. She told him that in an emergency or combat situation, everything needed to be easily accessible and repairable even without sophisticated tools. Occam's Razor. You can replace a switch or bypass a circuit in seconds. That's a lot harder to do with a busted touchscreen.
Applied to the crew size, it seems to me that the automation argument holds water, but would carry with it all kinds of dangers. In an emergency, sophisticated tech is hard to repair. In combat, 1000 people -- many of whom are not security-focused, and some of whom are civilians -- defending 200 acres seems like a bit of a challenge. Etc.
To the point about automation and computers... One of the novels -- I forget which one off hand -- addressed this, and I really love the line of thinking. Lt Uhura was having a conversation with some starbase doctor who was being a bit of a snob regarding the Enterprise's low-tech setup with physical switches, wires, and circuit boards in Sickbay. She told him that in an emergency or combat situation, everything needed to be easily accessible and repairable even without sophisticated tools. Occam's Razor. You can replace a switch or bypass a circuit in seconds. That's a lot harder to do with a busted touchscreen.
Applied to the crew size, it seems to me that the automation argument holds water, but would carry with it all kinds of dangers. In an emergency, sophisticated tech is hard to repair. In combat, 1000 people -- many of whom are not security-focused, and some of whom are civilians -- defending 200 acres seems like a bit of a challenge. Etc.
I don't think Picard believes in shopping malls, since that would require people to spend nonexistent money.
He and Beverly really need to have a talk about how she acquired that hideous bolt of cloth in "Encounter at Farpoint" (she has a charge account on the ship), and how Tasha got her sexy outfit from "ship's stores" after Deanna selfishly refused to share in "The Naked Now".
Highly variable I suspect.
AFAIK, no canon source has ever opined on even an average figure, however at least one licensed poster released during the series run suggested an operational crew of around 800 with around 200 civilian scientists and passengers.
YMMV.
AFAIK, no canon source has ever opined on even an average figure, however at least one licensed poster released during the series run suggested an operational crew of around 800 with around 200 civilian scientists and passengers.
YMMV.
Why would the enterprise be undercrewed? It can even be run with far less people and all the extra space on the ent-D can be explained, as the following fragment shows
-Remember Me.
To be pedantic (what, a Trek fan being pedantic? Unheard of!) this was a pocket reality in which even when it's down to Crusher alone, the ship still runs. It even adapts to the shrinking reality.
That being sad, I think we need to separate the crew needed to keep the ship running and all the crewmembers in the various science departments (like Lt. Cmdr. Daren in Stellar Cartography) that are on the ship.
I just watched "Descent" today and wondered just how many crew members were transported to the surface to conduct the search. I thought it was interesting to see the ship staffed by a skeleton crew, with various officers covering stations they would not normally cover. I'm not sure what this adds to the discussion, but it does show that a science officer (I don't think Ensign Taitt is ever given an exact department, but we do know her thesis was on solar dynamics) covering tactical until she is relieved by Lt. Barnaby.
I'm sure that for a short time the Enterprise can be operated by a very small number of people. Eck, probably by nobody, just the on-board computer to get her from point A to point B. It would be interesting to know the minimum number of people needed for normal operation of the vessel for long periods.
I'd say that depends heavily on the era, any intended mission and how far it had to fly before replacement/relief personnel were available.
For instance, it was implied that even during the (late?) TOS era that a single person could fly the ship on a straight-line course back to base (though IMO more than a couple of days like this would be undesirable) and certainly auxiliary craft are capable of being operated in this way by the TNG era. Given modern auto-pilot and AI developments IRL since the Sixties and even the Eighties I find this credible.
On the other hand, per The 37s, Intrepid-class starships in contested space with a long journey ahead require at least seventy-five personnel for relief crews, damage control etc and are better off with around a hundred.
For instance, it was implied that even during the (late?) TOS era that a single person could fly the ship on a straight-line course back to base (though IMO more than a couple of days like this would be undesirable) and certainly auxiliary craft are capable of being operated in this way by the TNG era. Given modern auto-pilot and AI developments IRL since the Sixties and even the Eighties I find this credible.
On the other hand, per The 37s, Intrepid-class starships in contested space with a long journey ahead require at least seventy-five personnel for relief crews, damage control etc and are better off with around a hundred.
Considering that finally in "Strange New World" we see robots doing complex jobs, one might wonder what happened in the meantime because in the chronologically following series we see humans doing even menial repairs.
My favorite guess is that the unions protested.
At the risk of opening up an old debate, the DOTs are the best justification for not having -- or at least limited to an "alternative entry route" ala law enforcement -- enlisted personnel as they can fill many of the roles taken by the bulk of said personnel (engineering and systems techs and lab techs being the main ones).
ECHenry did a video a few years ago - 1012 people is tiny number of people for a huge ship like the Galaxy Class.
It's almost 9 million sq ft of floorspace, or around 8,800 sq ft per crew member. That's the size of mansion. The entire crew's quarters would only take up 2-3% of the floor space. She could hold a crew 100x the size at Nimitz class density.
It's almost 9 million sq ft of floorspace, or around 8,800 sq ft per crew member. That's the size of mansion. The entire crew's quarters would only take up 2-3% of the floor space. She could hold a crew 100x the size at Nimitz class density.
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