That's just quackers.
But at least you called me 'sir' so I'll admit you showed the proper respect.
Could modern Excelsior class beat an Intrepid in combat?
- Thread starter Xerxes1979
- Start date
But at least you called me 'sir' so I'll admit you showed the proper respect.
I know this is old and pointless, but, before the lock...
Warp cores can be replaced. Easily. Pimp that muthafucka with a Mark 22 and Intrepid gets smoked like a.... something something on a somethingorother.
Seeing as how the Excelsior-Class has survived several wars over the ninety or so years she's been in service, my money would be on her.
We didn't see a Consitiution-class ship, but parts of one. They may have been elements of a different, more modern "kitbash" design.
And FWIW, we saw two contemporaries of the Intrepid-class, a Nova-class and Prometheus-class, as part of a 26th century battle (alongside the Enterprise-J) in "Azati Prime".
Given that the upgraded Lakota was an even match against the Defiant, it would likely fare the same against Voyager - from a tactical/power point of view - because both Voyager and the Defiant were put into service around the same time-frame and implemented similar/same technologies - the Defiant got Quantum torpedoes though which were evidently placed there for the Dominion itself while no other ship had them at the time (it wasn't until later we saw them appearing on other ships).
Of course, Lakota had quantum torpedoes, and Voyager could carry those as well (no reason to think SF wouldn't place them on-board after the ship returned).
As others noted, ships can be upgraded, and for everything we saw in the series, Voyager is essentially a smaller Galaxy class... capable of same defensive/offensive capabilities, and same, if not larger power output allowing it to achieve higher warp velocities (whereas the Galaxy by the time of Voyager's placement into active service still couldn't achieve that high warp factors) - just smaller internal space and fewer torpedo count (though I doubt 36 was it's limit given it was put into service for a 2 week mission).
Just because the Excelsior is larger, doesn't mean it's larger warp core would be able to produce more power.
Voyager's smaller warp core was able to put it on top with the 'big boys' for it's time.
Subsequent upgrades would likely yield same results - as such, 'size' doesn't really matter when it comes to power - I think it's more relevant for deep space exploratory assignments and how many supplies you can carry.
And while I will agree that different designs will be more geared toward different assignments and will probably have more dedicated hardware for the task, it's likely the power output in weapons on a science class ship and shields can match that of larger ships if necessary, but the galaxy class would have more weapons 'ports' to fire at it's target while the science ship would probably have fewer (although we've also seen the Nova class having a fairly decent coverage).
Of course, Lakota had quantum torpedoes, and Voyager could carry those as well (no reason to think SF wouldn't place them on-board after the ship returned).
As others noted, ships can be upgraded, and for everything we saw in the series, Voyager is essentially a smaller Galaxy class... capable of same defensive/offensive capabilities, and same, if not larger power output allowing it to achieve higher warp velocities (whereas the Galaxy by the time of Voyager's placement into active service still couldn't achieve that high warp factors) - just smaller internal space and fewer torpedo count (though I doubt 36 was it's limit given it was put into service for a 2 week mission).
Just because the Excelsior is larger, doesn't mean it's larger warp core would be able to produce more power.
Voyager's smaller warp core was able to put it on top with the 'big boys' for it's time.
Subsequent upgrades would likely yield same results - as such, 'size' doesn't really matter when it comes to power - I think it's more relevant for deep space exploratory assignments and how many supplies you can carry.
And while I will agree that different designs will be more geared toward different assignments and will probably have more dedicated hardware for the task, it's likely the power output in weapons on a science class ship and shields can match that of larger ships if necessary, but the galaxy class would have more weapons 'ports' to fire at it's target while the science ship would probably have fewer (although we've also seen the Nova class having a fairly decent coverage).
True, though if you note I said "Appeared to be".
Just because we say the Nova Class and Prometheus Class still in service then it does not follow that the Intrepid Class would be. Even the Oberth Class was still in service some 80+ years after we first saw it. And perhaps if we judge by it's registry number it was as old if not older than the Consitution Class.
Just because we say the Nova Class and Prometheus Class still in service then it does not follow that the Intrepid Class would be. Even the Oberth Class was still in service some 80+ years after we first saw it. And perhaps if we judge by it's registry number it was as old if not older than the Consitution Class.
jpch, resurrecting a 2+ year old thread is usually frowned upon around here - but I'm going to let it remain open because some new discussion is being generated.
More than two-to-three posts in a row by the same poster is seen as spamming on TrekBBS. Use the multi-quote feature next time, please. Thanks!
There is no reason to think the Intrepid wouldn't survive 100 years into the future.
I think it might have been mentioned that ships would have an operational lifespan of over a century.
And even if it wasn't, the Excelsior is a pretty good indication that they can.
SF might have a policy of not constructing same designs any more after they reached desired numbers (replacements not included of course - unless a new design took place in the meantime)... which would probably indicate that there's a window of at least 15 to 20 years after which a design won't be made any more because new designs will take it's place - probably explains why there are so many Federation designs.
They have a tendency to build new designs around new technologies - and of course integrating new into old, but if a new design is better, then there's no reason to expend resources to construct an older design.
Or it might be that there's a period that might incorporate different armaments which could warrant design changes, after which older designs won't be built any more.
But yes, in the alternate timeline where the Federation was battling the Sphere builders, we saw both the Intrepid and the Prometheus.
It at least suggests that even without the conflict in question, certain designs will go on far into the future.
Indeed.
Far too many in fact when you consider that they all appear to do virtually the same job - other than role-specific designs like the Defiant.
Well, the Federation might have a different attitude towards this particular aspect.
They prefer variety... but among other things, we probably have to keep in mind that majority of SF ships we saw were probably older classes.
For example, we don't know if the Norway, Saber, Steamrunner and Akira classes are designs made in the post Enterprise-D era.
They could be from the Enterprise-C era (which featured the transition to phaser strips instead of ball like turrets).
The only designs we do know that come from the post Galaxy class era are:
Sovereign, Intrepid, Prometheus, and the Defiant.
As for the Nebula class, that one I'm not sure about really - though it could be a direct predecessor to the Galaxy class given the design similarities (except of course lacking in the neck and differently placed nacelles/pylons).
The Federation is quite large after all.
150 different species working together, and spanning 8000 Ly's by the mid/late 24th century.
Another thing to consider is the possibility that other nations have many different ship designs too, but only a few are involved with engagements with the Federation. Conversely, the most commonly encountered Federation ships with some nations might be the Miranda- and Excelsior-classes (just as examples).
The reason behind that was to 'not confuse the viewers' I think...
I never found this argument solid myself.
Plus, none of the tv series ever showed a Sovereign class... that was because they wanted to keep it exclusively for the movies.
A lot of the Ds9 battles featured stock footage and earlier battles didn't visually cover the Intrepid, though that can be attributed to an entirely different aspect - for example, the Intrepids were off doing something else, or a part of the fleets that didn't make it in time - or they were simply never visually shown (doesn't mean they weren't there).
On top of that, practically none of the fleet battles had Nebula class ships either... as far as Ds9 is concerned.
We saw mostly the Galaxy class, Excelsior (the version without the secondary hull modifications), Miranda's and the Defiant... an occasional Steamrunner and an Akira as well.
I never found this argument solid myself.
Plus, none of the tv series ever showed a Sovereign class... that was because they wanted to keep it exclusively for the movies.
A lot of the Ds9 battles featured stock footage and earlier battles didn't visually cover the Intrepid, though that can be attributed to an entirely different aspect - for example, the Intrepids were off doing something else, or a part of the fleets that didn't make it in time - or they were simply never visually shown (doesn't mean they weren't there).
On top of that, practically none of the fleet battles had Nebula class ships either... as far as Ds9 is concerned.
We saw mostly the Galaxy class, Excelsior (the version without the secondary hull modifications), Miranda's and the Defiant... an occasional Steamrunner and an Akira as well.
^which could be down to any number of reasons.
Older proven designs in the case of Miranda and Excelsior and to a certain extent Galaxy.
Fewer ships built of that type. Maybe the Nebula Class had a limited production run.
Certain newer classes not being built in high numbers such as the Intrepid Class as production shifted towards the Defiant Class. It would make sense in a war to build things like dedicated warships.
Older proven designs in the case of Miranda and Excelsior and to a certain extent Galaxy.
Fewer ships built of that type. Maybe the Nebula Class had a limited production run.
Certain newer classes not being built in high numbers such as the Intrepid Class as production shifted towards the Defiant Class. It would make sense in a war to build things like dedicated warships.
@Dek
while the Defiant and Voyager were built at the same time, the Defiant was purposefully built for battle whereas the Voyager was more for scientific missions...so the Defiant had far more weapons proportionally
so the excelsior would definitely beat the voyager or any intrepid class
while the Defiant and Voyager were built at the same time, the Defiant was purposefully built for battle whereas the Voyager was more for scientific missions...so the Defiant had far more weapons proportionally
so the excelsior would definitely beat the voyager or any intrepid class
The only battle to feature stock footage was the one in What You Leave Behind.
Two fleet battles on DS9 did feature Nebula class ships: Emissary and The Changing Face of Evil.
