Were MACOs Special Operations Forces or regular infantry?

[Shamrock Holmes]

Been re-reading various old topics on ranks and insignia and one particular question occurred to me.

It's often assumed in fanon that MACOs and the supposed successor forces of the Federation (Starfleet Marines) etc use the same spread of ranks as the regular US military.

I think this is unlikely, and think it is more likely that any MACO wearing insignia is a fully-training SpecOps soldier (in the SEALs, a one-stripe would be an SO3/SB3, a 'rookie' on the teams, but capable of acting as a trainer/JNCO if the situation requires it). Delta Force Operators don't wear rank insignia, but are usually assuming to similarily E4 and above, and Special Forces don't deploy anyone below E5 and their leadership roles are restricted to E-8s in the field and E9s at HQ level. UK Special Forces take it one step further in that they actually "demote" soldiers upon joining UKSF, your pay increases but only internal leadership are classed as NCOs and wear rank.

Does that make sense?

 

[Romulan_spy]

I seem to recall episodes of ENT that implied that MACOs were elite soldiers. So, I always assumed that MACOs were meant to be Star Trek's version of Special Operators even if they may not have been portrayed as functioning exactly like our modern day special operators.

 

[Timo]

The very name is highly suggestive. It's not just "Military", it's specifically the "Assault Command" thereof, and then the "Operations" branch of that Command to boot - clearly it's a subdivision of a bigger organization.

The gaudy mako shark badge is also a bit of a hint of this being just a specific "unit" within a bigger whole, I guess.

This naturally raises the question of what other Commands the Military has besides Assault Command. And what other branches there are to Assault Command besides Ops...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[The Wormhole]

Sadly, there isn't much backstory to the MACOs out there. Many assume they're a United Earth military force, indeed Beyond even refers to them as the United Earth Military Assault Command Organization, but from the show it seems just as likely they're part of the US military, given they use US military rank insignia, and Major Hayes stated in dialogue he attended West Point. Although they do use the command star from TOS as their logo, so who knows?

We know from Harbinger the MACOs have access to more advanced weapons and technology than Starfleet in the 2150s, but prior to Hayes and his team being assigned to the NX-01 they had never been in combat. The novels ignored the bit about being I combat and said the MACOs were usually assigned defense and protection of Earth colonies, where they faced any number of threats, usually pirate raids, but the occasional alien troublemakers as well.

Then there's the novelization to the episodes The Expanse/The Xindi that provides details quickly contradicted by the show anyway (including how "MACO" is supposed to be pronounced). There the MACOs are depicted to be ridiculously elite, with there being a MACO Academy which 91% of those who enroll drop out in the first few months, and out of those who stay, only something like 2% actually graduate the three year course. This doesn't seem to explain how the enlisted are train, however.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

The very name is highly suggestive. It's not just "Military", it's specifically the "Assault Command" thereof, and then the "Operations" branch of that Command to boot - clearly it's a subdivision of a bigger organization.

The gaudy mako shark badge is also a bit of a hint of this being just a specific "unit" within a bigger whole, I guess.

This naturally raises the question of what other Commands the Military has besides Assault Command. And what other branches there are to Assault Command besides Ops...

Timo Saloniemi

I'd argue that other divisions like Military Intelligence Command, Military Logistics Corps and Military Engineering Corps are all possible within the above template.

Personally, my "head canon" is that MACO actually stood for "Military Assault Commandos"

Sadly, there isn't much backstory to the MACOs out there. Many assume they're a United Earth military force, indeed Beyond even refers to them as the United Earth Military Assault Command Organization, but from the show it seems just as likely they're part of the US military, given they use US military rank insignia, and Major Hayes stated in dialogue he attended West Point. Although they do use the command star from TOS as their logo, so who knows?

I think that like Starfleet, the MACOs probably draw a significant amount of their forces and influence from the US, but given that the UE is the only authority we see on screen involved in "off Earth business", I don't see any explict reason to suspect that it is US only or reports to the US government.

We know from Harbinger that the MACOs have access to more advanced weapons and technology than Starfleet in the 2150s, but prior to Hayes and his team being assigned to the NX-01 they had never been in combat. The novels ignored the bit about being I combat and said the MACOs were usually assigned defense and protection of Earth colonies, where they faced any number of threats, usually pirate raids, but the occasional alien troublemakers as well.

Then there's the novelization to the episodes The Expanse/The Xindi that provides details quickly contradicted by the show anyway (including how "MACO" is supposed to be pronounced). There the MACOs are depicted to be ridiculously elite, with there being a MACO Academy which 91% of those who enroll drop out in the first few months, and out of those who stay, only something like 2% actually graduate the three year course. This doesn't seem to explain how the enlisted are train, however.

I could just about buy the idea that Lt Reed believed that his Armoury Team had more relevant experience of combat with aliens (it's pretty much a given that they had had a broader variety of contacts by that point), the idea of the MACOs as an "unblooded" force seems to me to be a ridiculous notion.

The attrition rates mentioned (and the fact that enlisted and officers appear to train together) would appear to be a good indicator that they are SpecOps as both of the above are typical for such organisations and less so of regular infantry.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Personally, my "head canon" is that MACO actually stood for "Military Assault Commandos"

Or MArine COrps.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

Or MArine COrps.

Potentially on the former, but I've never seen C, Co or CO used for "Corps", but rather "Company", "Command" or "Commanding Officer" (perhaps post integration, UFP "commanders" have to trained in both starship operations and ground operations and this 'taking on the MACO officer role' is designated by them wearing the old "MACO Star").

 

[arch101]

On Enterprise, the MACO's are used much like Marines were used on early US Navy ships. In the war of 1812, ships like Constitution carried a force of Marines aboard for boarding enemy ships or conducting shore operations. Even though Starfleet is supposed to be an exploration outfit, I always wondered why something like a Marine or MACO unit was never used like this before. Sure was effective for storytelling on Enterprise. Note how they stuck around for Series 4.

 

[Tuskin38]

given they use US military rank insignia, and Major Hayes stated in dialogue he attended West Point

Chevrons are not unique to the US Military, although I believe the gold Oak leaf is.

It's possible the MACOs evolved out of a Pre-UE US military group, and they kept the Oak Leaf and West Point as a base because of its military history.

 

[The Wormhole]

Personally, my "head canon" is that MACO actually stood for "Military Assault Commandos"

Your head canon is contradicted twice by actual canon, though those examples contradict each other. The arm-patches the MACOs wore says "Military Assault Command Ops." Meanwhile in Beyond Scotty calls them the Military Assault Command Organization.

I don't see any explict reason to suspect that it is US only or reports to the US government.

Despite the fact that they use US only insignia for the officer ranks and train at the US Military Academy?

I could just about buy the idea that Lt Reed believed that his Armoury Team had more relevant experience of combat with aliens (it's pretty much a given that they had had a broader variety of contacts by that point), the idea of the MACOs as an "unblooded" force seems to me to be a ridiculous notion.

It actually is stated in the episode they have no real combat experience, and they've only trained for combat:

ARCHER: The MACOs' tactics and technology are two, three years beyond Starfleet's. Why not let them pass on some of that expertise? You don't agree.
REED: The MACOs' expertise comes from simulated combat, all conducted on Earth. On the other hand, we've fought numerous alien species on many different worlds. If anything, we should be giving the MACOs the benefit of our experience.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Despite the fact that they use US only insignia for the officer ranks and train at the US Military Academy?

Trek's Ameri-centrism strikes again.

 

[Timo]

Non-US nations or the UN Peacekeeping and Global Oppression Force adopting the oak leaf long before WWIII is a distinct possibility. After all, police organizations all across the globe are eager to copy US symbology for the coolness value already.

Whether the MACO lack combat experience altogether, or merely relevant combat experience, is open to interpretation of Reed's turn of phrase. Moreover, we have to ponder whether he's speaking of the MACO, or the MACO: perhaps only Hayes' men are rookies, chosen because they underwent the special Alien Stamping Curriculum vital for the mission, and for that very reason avoided all the combat engagements in which their lesser colleagues regularly took part.

I think we are seeing something conveniently between Rangers/SEALs and the Army here. The name isn't a separate proper name like Ranger or SEAL but contains the name of the mother organization, still clearly establishing that the force is only a subset of the mother force; the specialty is not narrow (because Reed already had Starfleet specialists with better credentials for the special field) but not so wide as to encompass everything (Starfleet still guards the Human Embassy on Vulcan, say). Quite possibly the Military (a past/future word for that combat arm that is not Space Navy and may or may not encompass Planetary Navies or Air Forces) has been marginalized in the 22nd century already, having virtually nothing to do, and only its Assault Command ever gets any sort of action (there being nothing the Defense Command could hope to defend against, say), so it rises to disproportionate prominence just in time for Edison and his ilk to have splendid war careers.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Jedman67]

The portrayal of the MACO's isn't terribly realistic either (welcome to Star Trek!) but they are implied to be some form of Special Ops or Marines.
It makes no sense that heading off into the "Expanse," Starfleet would saddle the Enterprise with undertrained soldiers to "help them" complete their mission. It makes more sense that they are highly trained and capable soldiers that are simply combat-virgins, after all, Earth has had very little aggressive contact with aliens* so far.

 

[Jedi Marso]

Whatever they were, that was the closest we ever got to seeing something like 'Starfleet Marines' in Trek.

It would have been totally out of place, but imagine how fun it would have been to have Bill Paxton (RIP ) and a couple others from Aliens appear as MACO's.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

I think we are seeing something conveniently between Rangers/SEALs and the Army here. The name isn't a separate proper name like Ranger or SEAL but contains the name of the mother organization, still clearly establishing that the force is only a subset of the mother force; the specialty is not narrow (because Reed already had Starfleet specialists with better credentials for the special field) but not so wide as to encompass everything (Starfleet still guards the Human Embassy on Vulcan, say).

To my mind, given that (in USN terms) Starfleet contributes Gunner's Mates (and associated ratings) via Armory Technicians and Master-at-Arms/Investigator via Starfleet Security, the remaining "combat specialist"-type rating that's left for the MACOs is Special Warfare Operator (or Special Warfare Combatant-craft Crewman for pilots).

 

[Tenacity]

Despite the fact that they use US only insignia for the officer ranks and train at the US Military Academy?

22nd century Britain still has a Navy, so why can't America still have an Army?

 

[Timo]

That's debatable. Royal Navy was a career option for Reed's father, but the wording on whether Reed could have joined is ambiguous at best.

I mean, the question is whether Reed would have continued a naval career. But RN may be history at that point - it suffices that the United Earth has a seagoing force where Reed's aquaphobia would have relevance.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[The Wormhole]

22nd century Britain still has a Navy, so why can't America still have an Army?

I'm not questioning whether or not the US military still exists in the 22nd century. I was explaining why it seems as though the MACOs belong to it.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

I'm not questioning whether or not the US military still exists in the 22nd century. I was explaining why it seems as though the MACOs belong to it.

I'd take it one step further, what advantage is there in assuming that the MACOs are (for instance) purely a renamed US Navy SEALs or USMC Raiders, rather than a multi-national force under UE authority like Starfleet?

 

[The Wormhole]

I'd take it one step further, what advantage is there in assuming that the MACOs are (for instance) purely a renamed US Navy SEALs or USMC Raiders, rather than a multi-national force under UE authority like Starfleet?

Well, there simply isn't anything to suggest the MACOs are international. In addition to their American insignia and training at the American Military Academy, all the MACOs on screen are American appear to be American. Even Idris Elba spoke with an American accent for his scene as Edison. The only exception to this is Reed in the MU, though he likely took over after killing MU Major Hayes and could very well have had a background in Starfleet who saw MACO Major as a promotion.