THE HUR'Q...

[Farscape One]

I always wondered one thing... how did the Hur'q get the Sword of Kahless and other goodies to the Gamma Quadrant?

I think three possibilities...

One, they used the wormhole. I tend to discount this due to how the Prophets reacted to Sisko and Dax first entering the wormhole.

Two, their empire was really that big. If that were the case, you would think there would be more evidence of them littered about the Alpha Quadrant. Maybe not so much on the Gamma side, as it was Dominion controlled and they would likely have destroyed any evidence of ancient technological cultures to maintain the illusion they were always the dominant power among their subjugated races.

Three, they had a mode of travel that was faster than warp drive. Maybe like transwarp, transwarp hubs, subspace corridors, etc.

Thoughts, everyone?

 

[Tenacity]

Gamma side, as it was Dominion controlled

My impression is that the Dominion didn't control the majority of the Gamma, they had a fair size empire sure, but not to the point of dominating the quadrant.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

They could've used sleeper ships or been a very long-lived species so traveled all over with conventional warp drive.

 

[Leviathan]

The Hur'Q long ago solved the mysteries of the Plot Drive.

 

[Tenacity]

how did the Hur'q get the Sword of Kahless and other goodies to the Gamma Quadrant?

Federal Express, when it absolutely positively has to be on the other side of the galaxy by yesterday.

 

[Prax]

I think the Dominion being some Giant mysterious empire was somewhat recent. We hear from numerous people in the GQ, things like "When the dominion came and took over..."

 

[The Wormhole]

One, they used the wormhole. I tend to discount this due to how the Prophets reacted to Sisko and Dax first entering the wormhole.

The Prophets are not bound by linear time. From their perspective, Sisko and Dax could be the first to enter the wormhole, despite it being used centuries past.

 

[Voth commando1]

A few possibilities transwarp, some either means of advanced FTL, or perhaps they did indeed use the wormhole.

Also regarding the dominion its stated in sanctuary they conquered the group tha conquered the Skyreeans-apparently causing something of a chain migration.

I don't think the dominion controls the entire GQ more like 30-40%.

They control enough either directly or through indirect hegemony that no one can challenge them and given archaeological references apparently earlier empires have existed in the GQ after all the dominion states at most they are 10,000 years old. It's certainly plausible other states existed as for the Hur'ruq they were around 1000 years before DS9 meaning that they were outside of the dominion's influence if they could say they had an empire.

Perhaps the dominion expands slowly and methodically sort of a glacial conquest, mixed up with occasional larger campaigns against threats that have either directly attacked or threatened them or if they feel it's in their strategic interests to do so.

 

[Timo]

The significant thing is that the Dominion doesn't control the Gamma mouth of the wormhole, or at least did not control it before "In Purgatory's Shadow". Indeed, the Dominion had never even heard of the wormhole (which is probably why they had made no effort to control that region of space).

The Hur'q could have been using that passage forever and then some, and certainly in the 14th century timeframe when the Sword was stolen. And since the Prophets don't believe in before and after, Sisko bothering them "for the first time" is no showstopper for others doing it earlier than that!

As for how large the Dominion is, we really have no idea. anything between 0.01% and 381% of Gamma is possible in theory (as the UFP claims the remaining 19% explored by its intrepid ships or probes or telescopes or whatnot before any contact with the Dominion is made).

Interestingly, the Founders themselves hide on a planet that is just a short hop from the wormhole mouth originally, and then relocate to another hideout that is not much farther out; both can be reached in a matter of days by some of the slower Alpha starship types such as the Defiant. Is this sheer coincidence? In this scenario, the Founders could choose any location on the outskirts of their vast empire, and happen to choose one near the wormhole, unawares; when that location grows too hot, they choose another nearby because they now want a HQ close to the upcoming wormhole-related action.

Or is this an indication that there are not all that many locations to choose from? In this scenario, the Dominion is not large enough that the hideout planets could be placed at greater distances from the wormhole, even if the Founders desperately want to have safe separation for their latter hideout.

Whatever faith be placed on Dominion propaganda, they curiously fail to give any figures on how many planets or species they control. Sure, they may be 10k years old, but Bajor is more like 500k and still only encompasses half a dozen planets at best...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Tenacity]

I don't think the dominion controls the entire GQ more like 30-40%.

I would say more like one percent (if that), that's still a huge area given the size of a quadrant.

 

[Jono]

The Hur'q don't necessary need to use the Bajoran wormhole to use a wormhole. We've seen a couple in Trek and what set the Bajoran one apart was it was stable and massive enough to allow convoys to easily traverse it. That wormhole in TNG that they thought was stable could have had one end near the Hur'q, which gave them the chance to pop in the AQ/BQ for some light raiding. Then it suddenly decides to head elsewhere and we never hear fromt he Hur'q again.

 

[publiusr]

I wonder if "Hur'q" was just another name for the Husnock.

 

[The Wormhole]

I wonder if "Hur'q" was just another name for the Husnock.

"Hur'q" is just the Klingon word for outsider. I guess we don't know what their real name was, but I doubt they were the Husnock.

 

[Timo]

That they would have been an occupying presence, as postulated in the novels, and perhaps a master race unwittingly "uplifting" the Klingons from technological ignorance, is not something that flows smoothly from the pseudofacts established in "Sword of Kahless". In the DS9 episode, the Hur'q are just pillaging vikings of some sort, coming and then going. But admittedly the wording doesn't completely preclude the idea that the Hur'q would have ruled over Qo'noS for centuries, either.

The interesting question is, what role did the Gamma location of the hoard play to the Hur'q themselves? The place was an "ancient ruin", and underneath they had caves sealed with advanced technology, but there was nothing apart from Kor's boast to prove that this was "all that remains of the Hur'q". Did the Hur'q really hide stuff in their basement, protected against pillagers by fake walls and whatnot? That is, did they expect to be invaded or burglared? And if so, was their loot really more important for them than, say, their own homes or lives?

One might argue the Hur'q were native to Alpha, and a single band of marauders got stranded on the wrong side of the wormhole, perhaps after pillaging Bajor. They'd then set up shop on that planet, regardless of whether it was empty for taking or teeming with helpless natives, and arrange for the treasure chambers with the intent of getting back home but some day returning (insert your rationale for why they couldn't take all their hoard back with them - say, perhaps some of their ships broke down). And then something went wrong.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[kkt]

Maybe the Hurq knew how to make artificial wormholes that would last a predictable length of time and could travel the galaxy with them.

 

[Nerys Myk]

"Hur'q" is just the Klingon word for outsider. I guess we don't know what their real name was, but I doubt they were the Husnock.

Bob.

 

[Shawnster]

Iconian gateway.

 

[Jono]

The Hirogen could be as good as any candidate for the Hur'q. I could see a pack of them seeing the Klingons as possibly interesting prey. They also like to take trophies to show how cool they are.

 

[Shawnster]

So the Hriogen lost their advanced propulsion abilities over the centuries? Somehow that sword reached the Gamma Quadrant.

 

[Jono]

Why not? We've seen examples of societies that have undergone major changes that have seen them go backwards in technology. Though really they don't need anything different from standard propulsion technology since there is more than enough time between the Hur'q invasion and the finding of the sword for it to have made it to the GQ.

Plus ways of getting across space like wormholes or even crazy "throw your ship across the universe" aliens that don't demand on the travellers level of technology. This is after all how the Federation has had an impact in two quadrants (or at least areas of these quadrants) that are far, far removed from their home space.