olympic-class ship design and purpose

[varek]

The Olympic-class ship OF THE 2370s looked like the earlier Daedalus-class ship, with its spherical primary hull section. As such, it could signal its status as a noncombatant, hospital ship, so it would not be attacked.

The USS Pasteur was an example of this class of starship.

I think it is cool to use such a unique design for specific purposes.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Olympic_class

I think the Nova-class ship was designed specifically for scientific exploration, rather than as an escort, along these same lines.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Nova_class

 

[mythme]

is there a question in there?

The spherical primary hull of the Olympic would lend itself to maximum space for patient rooms, medical facilities, triage and evacuation situations.

 

[C.E. Evans]

The Olympic-class could be just a transport ship, with the Pasteur optimized to be a medical one. Other Olympic-class ships could be utilized as standard personnel and cargo carriers, IMO.

 

[Timo]

Or the sphere hull might be the cheapest to manufacture. Spheres are nice and voluminous, but curvature always reduces headroom. So for a ship intended to house people or stackable random cargo ought to be a box, like the holoship of ST:INS or the Jenolan. Or at least a pillbox of some sort, that is, a saucer. But a sphere consumes the least metal per cubic meter.

Perhaps Starfleet builds spheres when there are no requirements placed on the ship, and these generic ships then get assigned funny secondary roles. Say, modern USN hospital ships are ex-tankers...

It would help if we knew what drove Starfleet to design the Daedalus. The design is clearly old, judging by the registry of Sisko's desktop model, but canonically we don't know if it was created for the Romulan war - or before it or otherwise not for fighting. Perhaps the Daedalus was a purpose-built hospital ship, and after the war those weren't needed, so they were sent to explore...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kevman7987]

Or the sphere hull might be the cheapest to manufacture. Spheres are nice and voluminous, but curvature always reduces headroom. So for a ship intended to house people or stackable random cargo ought to be a box, like the holoship of ST:INS or the Jenolan. Or at least a pillbox of some sort, that is, a saucer. But a sphere consumes the least metal per cubic meter.

Perhaps Starfleet builds spheres when there are no requirements placed on the ship, and these generic ships then get assigned funny secondary roles. Say, modern USN hospital ships are ex-tankers...

It would help if we knew what drove Starfleet to design the Daedalus. The design is clearly old, judging by the registry of Sisko's desktop model, but canonically we don't know if it was created for the Romulan war - or before it or otherwise not for fighting. Perhaps the Daedalus was a purpose-built hospital ship, and after the war those weren't needed, so they were sent to explore...

Timo Saloniemi

In the Enterprise series finale, there was a reference to new warp 7 ships. When I heard that, I just assumed the writers meant the Daedalus class. In that case it would be Starfleet's post-Romulan War explorer.

 

[Robert Comsol]

Or the sphere hull might be the cheapest to manufacture. Spheres are nice and voluminous, but curvature always reduces headroom.

Which shouldn't be an issue once there is a patient's bed below the reduced-headroom area.

But a sphere consumes the least metal per cubic meter.

I was taught that a sphere gives you the most internal volume for the least exterior surface.

Actually I could imagine that the sphere is a section that could be placed as a satellite into an orbit, like an orbital hospital, while the stardrive section leaves and picks up another "cargo" or an additional "hospital".

That would, of course, bring up the question whether the main bridge was located within the sphere or the stardrive section.

Considering that previously seen sickbay sections on starships were circular in nature the sphere looks like a nice echo that rejects the traditional saucer.

It would help if we knew what drove Starfleet to design the Daedalus. The design is clearly old, judging by the registry of Sisko's desktop model.

Supposedly, it's the design of starships like the Archon, the Essex and the Horizon.

Now, according to the opening dialogue in "A Piece of the Action" the Horizon "landed" on Sigma Iotia. I find it myself hard to believe that the whole ship landed, but possibly the spherical section was already detachable, then, and could land on her own.

Bob

 

[vulcan redshirt]

With a spherical hull, the wedge shaped gaps between the actual hull and a more blocky interior room shape would be ideal for putting conduits,, power systems, air-con/life support, sewage systems etc, and since a ship needs these areas anyway, it could still be an efficient design.

 

[Timo]

...It just wouldn't be the most efficient design imaginable, not categorically so; the spherical shape would be no more advantageous than any other. It's just one possibility among many, and the maintenance personnel would appreciate the headroom of boxy solutions in the machine spaces, too.

I have some difficulty believing the Daedalus as depicted can even achieve warp seven, let alone her being the leading explorer to follow the Enterprise class. This ship appears very small, and could be more like the Oberth of the day than the Constitution or the Galaxy.

A detachable sphere is an intriguing possibility with the Daedalus, considering the slenderness of her neck; separation would be somewhat less obvious for the more sturdily mounted Olympic sphere. Whether the Horizon a) landed or b) was of the design seen on Sisko's table remains somewhat unclear, but I could see the sphere landing in emergency conditions only, as it mounts no visible propulsion systems and invisible ones aren't all that common in Trek.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

As such, it could signal its status as a noncombatant, hospital ship, so it would not be attacked.

That is a human rule during combat, one not likely upheld by other races--Odo stated that the Klingons didn't give special consideration to doctors.

The design would give the Olympic-Class a lot of usable internal space, pretty essential for a hospital ship. Besides, despite her function, she is armed, in AGT Worf said that the Pasteur's weapons weren't effective against the Klingon battlecruiser's shields.

 

[sojourner]

A sphere is really good at being efficient at volume to surface ratio. It's not really great when laying out decks. You end up with a lot of half height decks and sloped ceilings. So, it's not really good for creating a ship with lots of habitable space. Unless of course, you use a really large sphere which would minimize the amount of wasted deck space.

 

[varek]

...It just wouldn't be the most efficient design imaginable, not categorically so; the spherical shape would be no more advantageous than any other. It's just one possibility among many, and the maintenance personnel would appreciate the headroom of boxy solutions in the machine spaces, too.

I have some difficulty believing the Daedalus as depicted can even achieve warp seven, let alone her being the leading explorer to follow the Enterprise class. This ship appears very small, and could be more like the Oberth of the day than the Constitution or the Galaxy.

A detachable sphere is an intriguing possibility with the Daedalus, considering the slenderness of her neck; separation would be somewhat less obvious for the more sturdily mounted Olympic sphere. Whether the Horizon a) landed or b) was of the design seen on Sisko's table remains somewhat unclear, but I could see the sphere landing in emergency conditions only, as it mounts no visible propulsion systems and invisible ones aren't all that common in Trek.

Timo Saloniemi

I don't think the shape of the ship is really important, since it travels inside the warp bubble (as I understand it).

 

[F. King Daniel]

The Olympic-class ship OF THE 2370s looked like the earlier Daedalus-class ship, with its spherical primary hull section. As such, it could signal its status as a noncombatant, hospital ship, so it would not be attacked.

The USS Pasteur was an example of this class of starship.

I think it is cool to use such a unique design for specific purposes.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Olympic_class

I think the Nova-class ship was designed specifically for scientific exploration, rather than as an escort, along these same lines.

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Nova_class

I don't think the Olympic-class is designed as a hospital ship any more than the Daedalus-class was. I think what we saw was a generic starship (an update of the Daedalus layout in much the same way the Ambassador-class updates the Constitution or the Akira updates the NX-class layout) modified to serve as a floating hospital.

See also the USS Kelvin, whose Shuttle #37, the same external design as all the others, was modified as a medical/rescue shuttle.

 

[Robert Comsol]

Whether the Horizon a) landed or b) was of the design seen on Sisko's table remains somewhat unclear, but I could see the sphere landing in emergency conditions only.

From "A Piece of the Action":

KIRK: I'll explain it in more detail when I see him. The ship won't land, but we'll transport several people down. Well, that's a little difficult for you to understand, too. I'll explain it in more detail when I see you.

I think it stands to reason that Kirk knew the design of the Horizon and the Sigma Iotians had contact to its crew.

According to the dialogue it's rather obvious that Kirk anticipates Oxmyx to expect seeing a landing ship which is not going to happen (because the Horizon or its primary hull did land).

In general I notice the prejudice that primary hull-secondary hull separations only occur in emergency scenarios.

Already The Making of Star Trek made it clear, that saucer separation of the TOS Enterprise could occur in situations other than emergencies.

Bob

 

[F. King Daniel]

Wait, wasn't the Horizon the cargo ship that Travis' family in Star Trek: Enterprise flew? Supposedly "the book" was an unseen set decoration in the episode.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Wait, wasn't the Horizon the cargo ship that Travis' family in Star Trek: Enterprise flew? Supposedly "the book" was an unseen set decoration in the episode.

Mayweather's book was called "Chicago Gangs", the book in APOTA was "Chicago Mobs of the Twenties". For some reason the crews of the Horizons liked books on organized crime.

 

[Timo]

If somebody's hobby on the ship that contaminated Sigma Iotia was organized crime, the odds of him or her forgetting the only book on the subject on the planet would be much lower than for one-out-of-a-dozen being left behind...

Whether a cargo ship would have chosen to visit Sigma Iotia would probably chiefly depend on what kind of make-believe the Iotians were playing at the time. Perhaps they were imitating a space-savvy merchant culture interested in trading with Earthlings and other aliens, as their previous visitors had also been space traders? Perhaps the Book broke a millennia-old tradition on the type of game, and Kirk's visit (and the communicator left behind) will now restore the pattern to that of imitating random interstellar visitors.

OTOH, I would expect the Iotians to grow bored with these games fairly quickly; a century or two per each setting ought to be enough. Perhaps imitating the Book rather than the more generic aspects of the Horizon visit was a desperation move, an attempt to distinguish this visit from the previous fifty.

How much Kirk and pals really know about the Horizon, we aren't told. The ship had sent "reports", but was that a series of by-the-book messages to Starfleet, or did Kirk just label a random call from a random tramp a "report" because that's the language he himself speaks? Kirk could be operating from fairly minimal information here.

As for the Olympic and Daedalus designs, I'd very much like the spheres to be there for a purpose. None of the starship shapes make sense as such, to the 21st century real-world observer, but there's such variety out there, and it probably wouldn't exist if not for specific reasons driving the shapes.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Robert Comsol]

If somebody's hobby on the ship that contaminated Sigma Iotia was organized crime, the odds of him or her forgetting the only book on the subject on the planet would be much lower than for one-out-of-a-dozen being left behind...

Frankly, I always found that idea weird, that an Earth ship would carry such big books (= extra payload) on a topic not actually related to classic Earth literature or space travel.

Maybe the Horizon had something like an advanced 3D plotter that could create books like this from a database aboard the ship.

Bob

 

[Timo]

I'd think a Boomer ship would rather have, oh, fifty thousand tons of excess capacity most of the time, her attempts at trading at alien ports not always particularly successful. There's no point in getting pennywise about weight on a ship that big. Or about money, either: a typical sortie will probably involve freight worth more than a couple of libraries. Better invest in sanity by stocking up on comforts!

That said, instant creation of physical books sounds like a capacity that should have been available to all our Trek heroes at every era. Thankfully, none of the shows really goes out to indicate that the capacity would not have existed.

The Iotians really must have had something comparable, in order to kick up an industry capable of perfectly imitating 20th century Earth. A jump from "beginnings of industrialization" to perfect replication of early 20th century radio sets (or even pool tables) in a century just doesn't happen... not even if the Horizon left behind a thousand books on the subject.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Dukhat]

I have some difficulty believing the Daedalus as depicted can even achieve warp seven, let alone her being the leading explorer to follow the Enterprise class. This ship appears very small, and could be more like the Oberth of the day than the Constitution or the Galaxy.

I've never liked the notion that the Matt Jefferies design (which was meant to be an idea for the TOS Enterprise), got retconned into a Starfleet vessel from 100 years before TOS. To me it looks way too much like a ship from TOS. Of course, I'm no fan of the NX-01 either, which looks like a ship that would have come after TOS, so there you go...

 

[Timo]

We could be seeing "punctuated equilibrium" in action here: the only way for Earthlings to start exploring the stars was to invent TOS-level technology, after which nothing much happened for the next two or three centuries, except steady progress in exploiting this tech and the resulting steady expansion of known space. Anything less than NX-01/NCC-1701, complete with phasers, photon torpedoes and transporters, would have been insufficient for loitering outside the envelope of "Vulcan-approved" space. On the other hand, NX-01/NCC-1701 would be the result of interstellar synergy: Vulcan advice, plus secrets bought from Earth's other early interstellar contacts. That particular well would run dry very soon, as NX-01/NCC-1701 would already represent the best that Vulcans and Rigelians and Tellarites and Andorians could do, only with some minimal "export downgrades" remaining to NX-01 but none to NCC-1701.

Any improvements post-ENT would be the result of original research by the UFP, rather than immediate application of research conducted by foreign cultures over a period of millennia. And thus very slow going, even with the synergy advantages of the (supposedly) previously unseen alliance of cultures and knowhow.

Timo Saloniemi