How much of a threat were Dukat and the Pah-Wraiths?

[marsh8472]

In regards to episode "What you leave behind" how much of a threat were Dukat and the Pah-Wraiths? Dukat made some pretty bold threats at the end. I'm wondering how many of them he could have carried out had Sisko not stopped him.

DUKAT: Did you really think the Pah wraiths would choose you to be their Emissary? Soon the Pah wraiths will burn across Bajor, the Celestial Temple, the Alpha Quadrant. Can you picture it? A entire universe set in flames, to burn for all eternity. The Prophets have sent me a gift. Their beloved Emissary, sent forth like an avenging angel to slay the demon.
...
SISKO: First the Dominion, now the Pah wraith. You have a talent for picking the losing side.
DUKAT: Benjamin, please. We've known each other too long. And since this is the last time we will ever be together, let's try to speak honestly. We've both had victories and our defeats. Now it's time to resolve our differences and face the ultimate truth. I've won, Benjamin. You've lost.
SISKO: The Pah wraith will never conquer anything. Not Bajor. Not the Celestial Temple. And certainly not the Alpha Quadrant.
DUKAT: And who's going to stop us?

Where to begin with that question... get in line boys

Time travelers, the borg, species 8472, just to name a few in their corner of the universe.

 

[Shikarnov]

Seeing that the Federation already had technology to hurt the Prophet / Pah Wraith species with Chroniton radiation -- and understood that their native realm could be sealed or destroyed with Trilithium explosives or a phase-conjugate beam -- I think the Pah Wraiths would have proven to be a challenge, but not an insurmountable one. There may be plenty of blood spilled, but they would be stopped. Genuine super-beings, the Wormhole Aliens are not.

And speaking of: I highly doubt the Organians, Douwd, or Q would get in the way. All three -- and, indeed, all other super-beings we saw in the prime universe -- have sat out almost every major interstellar conflict in the history of Star Trek. And when they did get involved, it was typically for very personal reasons (the Organians didn't like fighting happening in their star system, and Kevin the Douwd wiped out the Ushnok only after they killed his wife). If two Borg invasions and the Dominion War weren't enough to provoke them into action, I doubt the Pah Wraiths would.

 

[Kevman7987]

I'm sure Q might have stepped in. Don't nobody mess with his pet species (humanity) but him!

 

[Jono]

You don't have an option for what I think they would do...or an "Other" either. Anyway, I think they would have found their way to the Orbs and used them to punch back into the wormhole. Along the way they'd probably kill a few people to get to the Orbs, but they'd more or less leave Bajor alone.

Dukat is a very unreliable source. I think they told Dukat what he wanted to hear as he was just a pawn to help free them. Their only goal did seem to be to get back to their "home" and get revenge on those that exiled them. I don't think they would particular care about the Bajorans, let along the AQ. Though I don't really think the Prophets really care that much about the Bajorans either.

Another thing is that they didn't seem all that powerful outside the wormhole. They don't seem to be able to do much in our universe unless they possess someone. Sure they could cause havoc that way, but not really sure why they would bother. Maybe if we knew why they were imprisoned in the first place we probably would have a better idea of what they might want.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Not clear. If they were able to reclaim the wormhole they'd probably have the time power the prophets have which would make them very hard to stop.

 

[matthunter]

The Q don't really give a toss - it's up to us to prove we're worthy of existence. So they'd probably shrug if Sisko wasn't up to the job as our representative.

As for the others, Kevin Uxbridge is resigned to not interfering again. And we don't even know if the Organians are still about (you'd have thought they'd have had something to say about it when Gowron launched a war against the Federation otherwise).

The Wraiths would likely work through proxies anyway - when they blocked the Wormhole at the end of S6, it seemed to cause a spate of bad luck for the Federation or good luck for the Dominion - at least enough to offset the Alliance victory at Chin'toka... And I'm not buying that Sisko's demoralisation after Jadzia's death was the sole explanation.

 

[marsh8472]

The Wraiths assuming also possess the same powers as the prophets were able to make an entire fleet of dominion ships vanish, kill dax, change history, change ferengi behavior, see into the future.

Though O'Brien nearly killed all the prophets with the chroniton beam too. Bajorian prophecy said the Wraiths would destroy Bajor if released. I tend to think they would do at least that much.

 

[Voth commando1]

If they threatened the universe itself a big gigantic if at that then Q might intervene. The organians either didn't care or had departed this plane of existence.

Beings like Kevin Uxbridge wouldn't do anything.

As powerful as the prophets/wraiths were in sure they could do a lot of damage. Reminds me of the Valar in the Silmarillion could annihilate a whole continent as a result of war.

They might be able to destroy Bajor, perhaps even cause a gotterdamerdung in the alpa quadrant/Milky Way.

But the Q if it ever threatened the whole universe or multiverse would intervene I think.

 

[J.L.W]

The whole idea of Gal Dukat, the Prophets and the Pah Wraiths shows how limited the show was only exploring any concepts in around 20 - 30 sets of one hour shows in seven seasons. Usually, in such shows, drawn from the spiritual beliefs of many in real life, entities such as these are concerned about matters such as real estate but are also abundantly concerned with controlling the ideology of people. Not that they be given money but they be worshipped as gods.

A real explanation of such a concept might have an ongoing and powerful set of believers in the Pah Wraiths that spread through Bajoran society like the commonly believed in Satan worshipping 'Illuminati' perhaps. Although not with de facto power of leadership.

The Pah Wraiths in this show were shown to be committed to evil. They are known to take over bodies, seemingly with sadistic pleasure such as how Kenko tormented Miles and how the Pah Wraiths chose Jake, Sisko's son, as a vessel (who at the end of the show describes being taken over by the Pah Wraiths as feeling that a being was pure evil!)

They are also shown to be fairly powerful on the same level as the 'Prophets'. I think Dukat possessed with the true power of these demonic entities would do a fair amount of damage, but how he would fair against various adversities is up to a writer to decide. If such entities (the Pah Wraiths) exist then other entities of similar power must also, and also the magicks used in the show would likely be more exhaustive than what we have seen, with a history, and considering it is Star Trek this would probably link to other things such as distant Bajoran tribes on other planets etc. For instance, the force always has to win out in Star Wars. Darth Vader cannot be defeated by Hans Solo and a new magic ray gun he has to be fought against by a positive force user.

These are some of my thoughts:

- Q would not be able to intervene because, if I were writing it, there would be a magickal reason why he could not, or at least a magickal reason why if he tried he would have a fight on his hands, not an easy day. Q saving the day does not fit into the mythology of Star Trek Deep Space Nine.
- The Borg, an absolutely devastating enemy by any rational calculation but always taken down to the level lower than the dumbest Clingon for the sake of the show would do the thing that was best for their collective, if they could more quickly and easily assimilate 500 worlds for the same energy it would take to oppose the Pah Wraiths over one planet, they would take the 500. Dukats telekinesis I imagine could destroy whole cubes and the Borg have no metaphysical/ magickal protection to call upon.
- Species 8472 would be easily massacred. Those energy weapons would have little effect on the Pah Wraiths.

I imagine Kes's people would be able to oppose them. But I do not see much standing in the way of Dukat's rampant destruction. Perhaps the entity that Wesley Crusher went to learn spirituality from?

Within the confines of the fictional concept that is the Pah Wraiths they need someone connected to a rival fictional positive spirituality to oppose them.

But the answer is that Sisko could not lose the battle in DS9, it is fiction, a fairy tail. The bad guy cannot win; that's just how it is!