Was "Deconstruction of Falling Stars an Alternative Ending? - Page 2

Reverend · January 24 2010, 09:40 PM

diankra wrote:

lennier1 wrote:

Hermiod wrote:

Wasn't it something to do with some enemy of Earth's opening multiple jump points inside the Sun ?

Sounds like it. But I can't remember whether it came from JMS or if it's just fanfiction.

As far as I recall: jms has confirmed that Sol going nova wasn't natural, but if he's said anything more than that I've missed it.

Here you go.

RoJoHen wrote:

Mr. Laser Beam wrote:

^ Enemy? I always thought it was like this:

Something I really want to know is why the humans at that point needed access to the Vorlon homeworld. It feels like cheating. Why can't they become that evolved on their own?

They do. They go to the Vorlon Homeworld after they'd evolved. Hence the swirly light and encounter suit.
What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

RoJoHen · January 24 2010, 10:12 PM

Reverend wrote:

They do. They go to the Vorlon Homeworld after they'd evolved. Hence the swirly light and encounter suit.
What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

Well, yeah, but I guess what I don't understand is, at that point, why is the Vorlon homeworld still so important?

Hell, how has the Vorlon homeworld stayed intact that long?!

Seven Of Five · January 24 2010, 10:30 PM

Wasn't the Vorlon homeworld protected even after the Vorlons left? I've had a brain fart.

Perhaps the evolution of humans allowed them to finally get into Vorlon space and claim it as their new home. Maybe they are going there to hide from the enemies sending Sol into a premature nova? Maybe they're defeated and are off to lie dormant for 1000 years, until the next war?

RoJoHen · January 24 2010, 10:31 PM

See, this is the one thing that I don't like about B5! Important stuff continues to happen after the show ends, and nobody tells me why!

Reverend · January 25 2010, 03:10 AM

RoJoHen wrote:

Reverend wrote:

They do. They go to the Vorlon Homeworld after they'd evolved. Hence the swirly light and encounter suit.
What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

Well, yeah, but I guess what I don't understand is, at that point, why is the Vorlon homeworld still so important?

Hell, how has the Vorlon homeworld stayed intact that long?!

Under normal circumstances, planets don't suddenly disintegrate just because a sentient race abandons it. Hell it's only a million years, not such a long time as far as planets are concerned.

As for why it's so important, well for one thing, while humans have certainly caught up in the tech department, there must be eons worth of information stored there and Lyta said it was all off limits until they had earned the right "in a million years".

RoJoHen wrote:

See, this is the one thing that I don't like about B5! Important stuff continues to happen after the show ends, and nobody tells me why!

Although B5 is a contained 5 year period, the world it inhabits doesn't end with the last episode. JMS plotted out the broad strokes of what happens for a million years in either direction. I think he equated it with a western where the hero walking into the sunset. Eventually that horse will fall over and die and the world goes on.

Forbin · January 25 2010, 03:20 AM

trevanian wrote:

I really WISH DECONSTRUCTION was the series ender, because SLEEPING is one of the worst wrapups on any SF show.

You're dead to me.

butlerd · January 25 2010, 03:36 AM

trevanian wrote:

I really WISH DECONSTRUCTION was the series ender, because SLEEPING is one of the worst wrapups on any SF show. But maybe that fits, because slipping it into 5th season makes it integrate with the lesser quality on display there throughout.

As much as I was rooting for B5 to go five years, in retrospect I wish it had wrapped at four (but then I wouldn't have DECONSTRUCTION, which I love, and I'd still have the crappy ending. guess I know now why I don't rewatch the show.)

Although it was as good of an end to the series as any I've seen (and probably better), I felt like everything was wrapped up better in "Objects at Rest" and, frankly everything that needed to have been said (or done) by that point in time was handled pretty well throughout that final season. SIL was certainly a touching coda to the series but I guess it never quite had the emotional impact on me that it had on a lot of people. We already knew Sheridan was going to die, we already knew Londo and G'Kar were gone, and by the end of OAR and the transition of the IA to Minbar, it was apparent that B5 was going to eventually become less relevant to the galactic powers in time, so it's destruction (as a result of de-commissioning) was somewhat anti-climactic IMHO. I will say, however, that the music composed by Christopher Franke for that final episode was superb!

Mr. Laser Beam · January 25 2010, 03:59 AM

Reverend wrote:

What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

In the far future, humans and Minbari are on the same level as the "First Ones", but not the same species, as such. They have simply moved on to that "level".

The Narn and Centauri, OTOH, did not make it that far. They haven't died out, they just remain as they are, and not 'evolved' to First One-ish status.

RoJoHen · January 25 2010, 04:03 AM

Reverend wrote:

RoJoHen wrote:

Reverend wrote:

They do. They go to the Vorlon Homeworld after they'd evolved. Hence the swirly light and encounter suit.
What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

Well, yeah, but I guess what I don't understand is, at that point, why is the Vorlon homeworld still so important?

Hell, how has the Vorlon homeworld stayed intact that long?!

Under normal circumstances, planets don't suddenly disintegrate just because a sentient race abandons it. Hell it's only a million years, not such a long time as far as planets are concerned.

As for why it's so important, well for one thing, while humans have certainly caught up in the tech department, there must be eons worth of information stored there and Lyta said it was all off limits until they had earned the right "in a million years".

Well, obviously planets don't just go away. That's not what I meant. But with nobody there to maintain the Vorlon Homeworld, with it essentially abandoned, it seems crazy that after a million years that anything worth having would still be around.

Or maybe I'm just frustrated because I never got to see it!

Mr. Laser Beam · January 25 2010, 05:32 AM

^ I'm sure the Vorlons placed very effective automated defense systems to protect their old world, when they left.

Reverend · January 25 2010, 05:47 AM

Plus of course all their buildings and technology are organic, so as long as they'd put in place a self sustaining biosphere it should still be more or less how they left it. Failing that all the REALLY important stuff could be buried miles underground for safe keeping. Indeed, the one time we got to see the Vorlon homeworld (aside from the Lost Tales titles) it was a HUGE cavernous chamber thal looked like it went on for miles, so most of their stuff could very well have been underground by that stage. It's also possible they have a technology similar to the nullentropy bins in the later Dune books that can preserve things indefinably.

Mr. Laser Beam wrote:

Reverend wrote:

What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

In the far future, humans and Minbari are on the same level as the "First Ones", but not the same species, as such. They have simply moved on to that "level".

The Narn and Centauri, OTOH, did not make it that far. They haven't died out, they just remain as they are, and not 'evolved' to First One-ish status.

That wasn't established either way and though it sounds familiar, I haven't come across a JMS post to that effect.

Jan · January 25 2010, 06:36 AM

Reverend wrote:

Mr. Laser Beam wrote:

Reverend wrote:

What I've never been clear on is if humanity is still a separate species to the Minbari or if they've essentially become one and the same?

In the far future, humans and Minbari are on the same level as the "First Ones", but not the same species, as such. They have simply moved on to that "level".

The Narn and Centauri, OTOH, did not make it that far. They haven't died out, they just remain as they are, and not 'evolved' to First One-ish status.

That wasn't established either way and though it sounds familiar, I haven't come across a JMS post to that effect.

Here it is:

Will Caraway asks:
> Which brings me to my question, did the Minbari, the Narn, or the
> Centari also achieve the evolutionary state of the first ones?

The Minbari eventually make it; the Narn and Centauri do not.
They don't die out, they just don't hit a state of First One-ishness,
which is darn close to immortality (barring violence).

jms

Jan

Reverend · January 25 2010, 07:04 AM

I thought I'd seen that before, but a quick search didn't turn it up.
Interesting, so the Narn & Centauri are still around but their evolution dead ended before getting to the First One/Ralgan/Ironheart level? You have to wonder what it's like for a civilisation to get left behind like that.

The reason I wondered about Humans & Minbari merging was partly down to the design of the encounter suit havong what looked like a Minbari crest.

StarshipDefiant · January 25 2010, 07:29 AM

Reverend wrote:

I thought I'd seen that before, but a quick search didn't turn it up.
Interesting, so the Narn & Centauri are still around but their evolution dead ended before getting to the First One/Ralgan/Ironheart level? You have to wonder what it's like for a civilisation to get left behind like that.

The reason I wondered about Humans & Minbari merging was partly down to the design of the encounter suit havong what looked like a Minbari crest.

Well... that's because...

Mistral · January 25 2010, 10:52 AM

StarshipDefiant wrote:

Reverend wrote:

I thought I'd seen that before, but a quick search didn't turn it up.
Interesting, so the Narn & Centauri are still around but their evolution dead ended before getting to the First One/Ralgan/Ironheart level? You have to wonder what it's like for a civilisation to get left behind like that.

The reason I wondered about Humans & Minbari merging was partly down to the design of the encounter suit havong what looked like a Minbari crest.

Well... that's because...

Because the show was about the Rangers, at least in spirit. TH ecombining of different races technologies. But I took Deconstruction as the ending or coda JM might have written as an after thought-like, oh, damn, I get another season? Well, we need to tell them about my million-year-vision. Which is why I posted the question. But please-keep going...