Google SketchUp Federation Class

[Patrickivan]

You may remember my Federation Class Terran/Vulcan hybrid ship. Well, after some practice in sketchup, I think I’ve got the basic skills to tackle this ship. So here are a couple of pics to show her build up underway. It’s addicting!

Here's a reminder image of what I want to end up with...


And here is my progress to date...

Above: The port bow; The start of the bridge; and ship dimensions in metres.

Above: Aft section; Shuttle Deck (the big open space that is 5 metres in height (16.4 feet for my American friends)

The overall length is just over 77 metres (252+ feet).

[Cary L. Brown]

Patrickivan wrote:

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You may remember my Federation Class Terran/Vulcan hybrid ship. Well, after some practice in sketchup, I think I’ve got the basic skills to tackle this ship. So here are a couple of pics to show her build up underway. It’s addicting!

Isn't it though? The transition from "inside my head" to "actually exists" (even if it's only within a computer program) is what I love most about what I do (for work and fun alike).

Here's a reminder image of what I want to end up with...


And here is my progress to date...

Above: The port bow; The start of the bridge; and ship dimensions in metres.

Above: Aft section; Shuttle Deck (the big open space that is 5 metres in height (16.4 feet for my American friends)

The overall length is just over 77 metres (252+ feet).

Just one piece of advice... while I know that the idea of laying in decks first and then skinning over it is pretty common, I've found that this is actually a lot harder. I prefer creating the exterior shapes, then "slicing" the decks in. You might discover that some of your deck sections don't "quite" work and need tweaking, otherwise, but everything else will be in place already.

That said... it's your baby, and you're using a different tool than I do so it might work out perfectly fine. I'm just saying what my personal experiences have been.

In any case, I'm looking forward to seeing how this turns out!

[Patrickivan]

Cary L. Brown wrote:

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Isn't it though? The transition from "inside my head" to "actually exists" (even if it's only within a computer program) is what I love most about what I do (for work and fun alike).

Just one piece of advice... while I know that the idea of laying in decks first and then skinning over it is pretty common, I've found that this is actually a lot harder. I prefer creating the exterior shapes, then "slicing" the decks in. You might discover that some of your deck sections don't "quite" work and need tweaking, otherwise, but everything else will be in place already.

That said... it's your baby, and you're using a different tool than I do so it might work out perfectly fine. I'm just saying what my personal experiences have been.

In any case, I'm looking forward to seeing how this turns out!

Thanks Cary- I've been doing this on and off since about 10 this morning. I really have to just turn off the computer now, and pour a glass of wine and shoot terrorists in Rainbow Six (from one comp to another)... (And by the way, you and CTM where the ones who inspired me to give this a shot, and put some real thought into it).

But I love it. The day just flys by, even when I'm re-working the most tedious little detail over and over until I get it right

I'm still learning, and since this is my first attempt at building anything larger then the shuttle, (heck, this is really only my 3rd build!), laying the decks did seem like a simple approach. Though I have run into some issues with the skin.

I've also spent some of the day taking the original drawings and coming up with a scale that seems workable and reasonable, but there's still some issues, and that's primarily because I'm still unfamiliar with how some of the tools work and interact with each other.

That being said, here are my last posts for the day. I've included a few blue scale indicators (188cm person), just to put some of the ship into perspective. I'm astonished how long some things take, and I'm sure I'll be astonished how much time I can save as I become more proficient with this little programme...


Above: The aft section showing the shuttle deck, shuttle control, and a lift (no turbo yet!)

Above: Some bridge work. Note the centre lift door. It's recessed, and wraps the shape of the lift. There are also two doors on either side of the lift, one to the CO's room, and one to a room that has access to a washroom, and access to a crawl space around the bridge.


Above: Just an image with little blue "men" for scale. They're 6'2" (my height of course!)....

[Patrickivan]

Unfortunately I won't be able to work on the ship today. It's Halloween so I've got to bring the garage to a state of readiness to facilitate my endeavours in making children cry and pee themselves. Plus it's my daughter's B-day party, and I have to make her undead head cake...

Is it sad that I'd really really really (really!) rather be working on this model!?

I am a bad, bad, father

[Patrickivan]

Here are my morning updates. Got the lower decks in place and some of the skin on. I'm putting in some minor interior details as I go. Well- the major rooms. There are 2 fuel tanks on the lower decks. They're each 8 metres long by 2 metres across.

[BorgMan]

While you're on a good path, I think this will cost you a lot of time. First, because you need to create every single face of the hull, but the second one can be a real pain: what if you find out that the created hull looks ugly? Therefore I would suggest you create the outer hull first, then the inner hull (you need that to make sure your decks don't mess up the outer hull), and then use big rectangles to make your decks. If you use the Intersect with Model option on the inner hull, you can delete the rest of the rectangles which leaves you with the actual decks. Another piece of advice: work in halves. No need to start modelling the whole thing if most of it is symetrical anyway. Also: make use of the Follow Me command. I noticed that your bridge isn't different on any part at all, but you seem to be making it out of copy-pasting the arches. If that's not correct, don't mind me saying it, but as far as I can see it looks like you're wasting a LOT of time in something that could be done within a few seconds (litteraly).

If you need advice on a (whenever possible) realtime base, add me to MSN. I'll be glad to help you out. If so, PM me for the addy

[jaspertjie]

It's not my class of ship that I like but I have to say that it's actually very well done.

[CuttingEdge100]

How hard is Google SketchUp to use?

[Patrickivan]

CuttingEdge100 wrote:

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How hard is Google SketchUp to use?

Well- kind of easy, but there does seem to be a better way of using Sketchup, and that's why I'm going to messege Borgcat, right now...

Otherwise, it's fun, not too difficult to learn, but there is an obvious learning curve, and I've got a long way to go.

[BorgMan]

I suggest y'all head over to SFM (more specifically, this thread) and check out the tips and tricks that everybody gives. That should help a lot.

Sketchup is easy to use, but a bit hard to master. You can get renders that are perfect, but before you're there there's a lot of effort to put into it. For example, the first model I ever made was a warpcore. I made the walls using the same method as Patrick now uses to make the outer hull of his bridge. That changed when I learned of the Follow Me tool. And with every quality plugin my experience with the program becomes better

[Patrickivan]

Here are a couple of images where I used the follow me tool to extrude the skin on the primary section, the bridge, the planetary sensor, and some other minor details. It really makes a quick difference (thanks BorgMan!), but I'm working it on the existing model, and I'm finding some things to be difficult. I may start the ship from scratch, but this is good experience I think. To find out what doesn't work well is a good thing to know.

[Patrickivan]

I decided to try a quick remake of this ship by using the external dimensions of the model (roughly) and heavily using the "follow me" and "extrude" tools. This is what I came up with in about an hour. I can say that I am greatly pleased with this, and can't wait to make the nacelles... Thanks for the advice Cary and Borgman!

Because I was using rough dimensions, the primary section is about 10 metres longer then it's supposed to be, so I backed it up into the neck by about 10 metres. It looks a little odd. But otherwise, it's pretty close to what I wanted. The lower hull is a little too curvy for the era I was shooting for, but when I started the second model, it was more an attempt to play around with the tools, and I got carried away and kept going with the rest of the ship.

Any comments are welcome of course. Now I have to learn how to use the slice tool to put in the decks...

[Cary L. Brown]

Well, remember that my "tool of choice" is a different tool and it works a lot differently...

That said, when I do it, I make the outside... and since my tool is "solids-based"... that means that I get a solid ship. I then go in and create copies of my outside surfaces and offset those copies to create a "quilt" which represents the inside of the hull thickness. I then create cuts which extend to the inside-hull "quilt" and those become the hollow volumes of my decks. Then, I just have to populate the guts of the ship. (which isn't as easy as it sounds there, obviously!)

Now, as I understand Sketchup, it's entirely surface-based... that is, you're created surfaces of zero thickness and "stiching" them together. Is that accurate?

If that IS true... my approach would be to make the entire outside of the ship and then create a series of large flat surfaces to represent floor and ceiling heights... and then trim portion of those which fall outside the hull away. What you'll have left are deck floors and deck ceilings that perfectly fit your exterior.

Actually, I'd probably do an "offset" to create an inner hull, from that outer hull you start with, and do my deck floor/ceiling trimming from that. So even though you won't have a "solid" hull, you'll have the surfaces which are visible.

Then again, I've never used Sketchup, so your mileage may vary.

One thing that's important to do FIRST is the get all the shapes... including any rounds or chamfers... in place for that hull exterior before you make the internal stuff. You can leave off "nernies" and details, but try to get the shapes trully "right" first.

[kaisernathan1701]

Very cool stuff

[BorgMan]

You're correct Cary: you stitch stuff together most of the time unless you use Follow Me extensively; I'll see if I can whip up a wireframe of my own model soon.

Patrick, I suggest you delete the lines on the outer side of the primary hull. If those are your decks, delete them for now. Next, as Cary suggested, copy the outer hull and paste it next to the model, then make it a little smaller using the Scale tool. When you're done, move it to the inside of the model and reverse the faces (purple on the surface you'd see if you would look at it are bad). Then you're set to make the interior. Don't forget: work in halves! This makes making interiors much easier.

Also... Give it it's neck back. If you really want to adhere to your own speclist that's fine, but why would you? Extend it a little bit more, makes it look a lot better

[DestinyCaptain]

I think it looks great, but.....does anyone else see "toilet" in the middle view? Just me?

[Patrickivan]

DestinyCaptain wrote:

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I think it looks great, but.....does anyone else see "toilet" in the middle view? Just me?

I do NOW!!! Thanks!


I've just read your post BorgMan and Cary, so I'll give your respective advice a try. I've already started to experiment with slicing the model, that I used to slice the primary section in half and shorten it the appropriate 10 metres. I then pulled the hull forward, stretching the neck the 10 metres it was supposed to be...

I've added the nacelles (I just made one and copied it), but I'm not happy with them (nor am I happy with the nacelle support struts- they need to be a little thicker). I've also added the deflector dish, planetary and forward sensors, and cleaned up some lines.

We'll call this ship the Mk II model. I'll work on it a little more, and then try the next version, implementing the advice I've been given, and using what I've already learned of course.

So here is the ship, heading in the right direction, but it still has a way to go...

[sojourner]

Looks good for a start!

Gah, I haven't messed with Sketchup in a while. I need to find a new design project that I can work on feverishly then grow bored with and never finish.

Hey Vance, here's the last image from the Capella class before I put the project aside. I really should finish that up.
http://s479.photobucket.com/albums/r...apimpulse1.png

[Patrickivan]

sojourner wrote:

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Looks good for a start!

Gah, I haven't messed with Sketchup in a while. I need to find a new design project that I can work on feverishly then grow bored with and never finish.

Hey Vance, here's the last image from the Capella class before I put the project aside. I really should finish that up.
http://s479.photobucket.com/albums/r...apimpulse1.png

That reminds me of my very first kitbash idea when I was about 16. I took my TOS E, took the neck off, and tried to merge the lower hull to behind the saucer, and extend the nacelles off to the side.

My attempt was an unfortunate failure.

[Cary L. Brown]

Patrickivan wrote:

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I do NOW!!! Thanks!


I've just read your post BorgMan and Cary, so I'll give your respective advice a try. I've already started to experiment with slicing the model, that I used to slice the primary section in half and shorten it the appropriate 10 metres. I then pulled the hull forward, stretching the neck the 10 metres it was supposed to be...

I've added the nacelles (I just made one and copied it), but I'm not happy with them (nor am I happy with the nacelle support struts- they need to be a little thicker). I've also added the deflector dish, planetary and forward sensors, and cleaned up some lines.

We'll call this ship the Mk II model. I'll work on it a little more, and then try the next version, implementing the advice I've been given, and using what I've already learned of course.

So here is the ship, heading in the right direction, but it still has a way to go...

Well, what you're experiencing is how real engineering works as well. It's almost entirely unheard-of for someone to end up using their first version of something (regardless of how simple or how complex) as the final version which sees production. More often than not, you work through pretty far on "version one," then realize that something's wrong, or that all the tweaks you've done over time has resulted in your files becoming an unmanageable mess, or just realizing that you can't get to where you're trying to go from where you are at the moment. So, you use the stuff you've done so far to guide you on getting your second (or third, or twenty-second) try right.